Avoiding roof corrosion?

[Perfectos]

Yes still on seal #4

I had one seal fail in exactly the same spot as in your photo

that is classic rust in the seal, get it cleaned off ASAP,
look at the seal recess in the corresponding spot where the rust has transferred to the roof.
dry the seal fully (leave it off until the seal is fully dry in the recess)
When the seal is dry ; spray with Silicone etc. (Anything to help slow the rust & resist transfer to the paint ) let it dry before refitting the seal

clean off the paintwork ASAP
I sprayed the panel as well which assists in taking the rust stain off, but note Silicone will linger on the paint and resist paint in future unless cleaned off really well. (I had no issues using silicone spray, initial spray, wipe off to remove the rust stain , then re spray & let it dry before

Then put a bit of tape over the area on the panel where the seal rust is in contact with the paint (extend the tape well past the affected area ) Sellotape etc , any thing to create a temporary barrier. (I used helicopter tape but any tape to create an impermeable barrier will do ) remove the tape before fitting the new seal

Then get the seal changed ASAP.

edit, I spray silicone into the seal recess after checking (twice per year ) the silicone helps the rubber swell and seal against the panel and allows the seal to slip into place

IMO the roof seal is not fit for purpose

edit: I have had the VW tape fitted to the leading edge of the roof (done by the dealer) to help protect the roof edge (before the fourth seal was fitted.)

I also saw the dealer fitting the third seal, they banged the seal onto the leading edge (using their hand ) which I suspect contributes to the premature failure of the seal (it only need to be pressed onto the edge)

 

[yossarian]

Yes still on seal #4

I had one seal fail in exactly the same spot as in your photo

that is classic rust in the seal, get it cleaned off ASAP,
look at the seal recess in the corresponding spot where the rust has transferred to the roof.
dry the seal fully (leave it off until the seal is fully dry in the recess)
When the seal is dry ; spray with Silicone etc. (Anything to help slow the rust & resist transfer to the paint ) let it dry before refitting the seal

clean off the paintwork ASAP
I sprayed the panel as well which assists in taking the rust stain off, but note Silicone will linger on the paint and resist paint in future unless cleaned off really well. (I had no issues using silicone spray, initial spray, wipe off to remove the rust stain , then re spray & let it dry before

Then put a bit of tape over the area on the panel where the seal rust is in contact with the paint (extend the tape well past the affected area ) Sellotape etc , any thing to create a temporary barrier. (I used helicopter tape but any tape to create an impermeable barrier will do ) remove the tape before fitting the new seal

Then get the seal changed ASAP.

edit, I spay silicone into the seal recess after checking (twice per year ) the silicone helps the rubber swell and seal against the panel and allows the seal to slip into place

IMO the roof seal is not fit for purpose

edit: I have had the VW tape fitted to the leading edge of the roof (done by the dealer) to help protect the roof edge (before the fourth seal was fitted.)

I also saw the dealer fitting the third seal, they banged the seal onto the leading edge (using their hand ) which I suspect contributes to the premature failure of the seal (it only need to be pressed onto the edge)

Thanks for documenting this so well. Will be onto my dealer shortly.

No idea what VW were thinking when they applied tape to only 3 edges.

 

[Perfectos]

Thanks for documenting this so well. Will be onto my dealer shortly.

No idea what VW were thinking when they applied tape to only 3 edges.

Don’t rely on the dealer to remove the rust stain, do it yourself.
This will not be a priority call for any dealer, so it may be many weeks or even months before you get a slot to be seen, (to comply with the VW edit that warranty claims must be assessed at the dealers premesis by the dealer) then you will invariably have to go back to have the old seal removed and the new one fitted.
I short cut this process on several occasions by sending photos of the failed seal (rust in the seal & on the roof ) to the dealer on discover, I then asked for a new seal to be ordered in advance of my initial visit (agreed to pay for the seal if VW believed there was no warranty claim ! - the seal is about £80) which slowed the dealer to diagnose the issue and fit a new seal at the same time, saving me another 40 Mile round trip !

It is the steel particles migrating through the paint that cause the issue, remove the stain from the paintwork as soon as you see it and prevent the rusted seal reinforcing from touching (making contact with the paintwork ) hence the tape suggestion.

I also applied a bit of masking tape to the roof as a visual aid, just before i went into the dealer, so they had no issue in immediately identifying where the seal had failed.

the dealer should on immediately discovering the failed seal act on the workshop action 75A1, which gives them authority to change the seal.

good luck, report back to help others.

 

[Perfectos]

This thread is worth a read, see posts fromVW Guru in particular

Just announced - T6 recall for roof corrosion beneath the seal

VW have introduced a recall for the well documented issue of roof corrosion / paint bubbling below the seal. The roof will be inspected with the seal removed and if ok protective "foil" will be applied. I dont have any info regarding what will happen If not ok but I will find out today /...

vwcaliforniaclub.com

 

[Viktorgeorge]

Yes still on seal #4

I had one seal fail in exactly the same spot as in your photo

that is classic rust in the seal, get it cleaned off ASAP,
look at the seal recess in the corresponding spot where the rust has transferred to the roof.
dry the seal fully (leave it off until the seal is fully dry in the recess)
When the seal is dry ; spray with Silicone etc. (Anything to help slow the rust & resist transfer to the paint ) let it dry before refitting the seal

clean off the paintwork ASAP
I sprayed the panel as well which assists in taking the rust stain off, but note Silicone will linger on the paint and resist paint in future unless cleaned off really well. (I had no issues using silicone spray, initial spray, wipe off to remove the rust stain , then re spray & let it dry before

Then put a bit of tape over the area on the panel where the seal rust is in contact with the paint (extend the tape well past the affected area ) Sellotape etc , any thing to create a temporary barrier. (I used helicopter tape but any tape to create an impermeable barrier will do ) remove the tape before fitting the new seal

Then get the seal changed ASAP.

edit, I spray silicone into the seal recess after checking (twice per year ) the silicone helps the rubber swell and seal against the panel and allows the seal to slip into place

IMO the roof seal is not fit for purpose

edit: I have had the VW tape fitted to the leading edge of the roof (done by the dealer) to help protect the roof edge (before the fourth seal was fitted.)

I also saw the dealer fitting the third seal, they banged the seal onto the leading edge (using their hand ) which I suspect contributes to the premature failure of the seal (it only need to be pressed onto the edge)

Well I am really grateful to @Perfectos et al for getting me concerned enough to check my roof seal.

Only 7 months old (though in a seafront home) I had tried once or twice to check the seal on my Ocean but found it fairly keen to stay put. But with the warmer weather, I had another go today: much easier to remove in the hot sun: but, bad news!

I followed the general advice above and elsewhere, starting from the back I removed first that section full width, wiped everything clean, Collinite polished all the paintwork adjacent to the seal, cleaned dried and Gummi Pfledge'd the seal itself and found no problems. Phew (I thought). I then did each side, half at a time (using the hinge brackets as halfway markers): ditto (I thought). Then the front section, and urgh, three rusty zones. I cleaned everything, taped (with black electrical tape) the aluminium roof locally to each of the three rust zones, treated the rust zones, within the seal, with ACF50, then cleaned dried and Gummi Pfledge'd the whole front part of the seal.

So now I will be on to VW Commercial Ipswich next week. They are not California specialists, but I will start there (and if necessary travel further for a sympathetic California Dealer if necessary for example Breeze Poole - though all suggestions welcome).

Now that I have learnt the skills, I think I would rather replace the seal myself, or together with a master tech, as it is pretty clear that - apart from a seal with steel reinforcement being a problem waiting to happen (surely nylon could be substituted?) - these seals are not fitted at the factory with the care and aftercare they need (the steel reinforcement clearly breaks through the rubber if manhandled at assembly, which must be the case in my case).

Thankfully the aluminium roof has only surface rust marking (no paint bubbling), so the corrosion is confined to the seal. I think if it had been left rather longer the the painted aluminium would have been damaged.

As others have noted, the protective tape is only applied to the back and sides of the aluminium roof, and not to the front where the rust problems have arisen. In fact, I wonder if the steel reinforcement to the seal is only on the front section, anyway.

I also wonder whether black electrical tape (i.e. non conductive) all round the aluminium roof, to the full height of the seal would be a sensible improvement. It is additionally easier to shape than most tapes, being elastic.

Photos herewith:

 

[Perfectos]

Well I am really grateful to @Perfectos et al for getting me concerned enough to check my roof seal.

Only 7 months old (though in a seafront home) I had tried once or twice to check the seal on my Ocean but found it fairly keen to stay put. But with the warner weather, I had another go today, much easier to remove in the hot sun: but, bad news!

I followed the general advice above and elsewhere, starting from the back I removed first that section full width, wiped everything clean, Collinite polished all the paintwork adjacent to the seal, cleaned dried and Gummi Pfledge'd the seal itself and found no problems. Phew (I thought). I then did each side, half at a time (using the hinge brackets as halfway markers) ditto (I thought). Then the front section, and urgh, three rusty zones. I cleaned everything, taped (with black electrical tape) the aluminium roof locally to each of the three rust zones, treated the rust zones, within the seal, with ACF50, then cleaned dried and Gummi Pfledge'd the whole front part of the seal.

So now I will be on to VW Commercial Ipswich next week. They are not California specialists, but I will start there (and if necessary travel further for a sympathetic California Dealer if necessary for example Breeze Poole - though all suggestions welcome).

Now that I have learnt the skills, I think I would rather replace the seal myself, or together with a master tech, as it is pretty clear that - apart from a seal with steel reinforcement being a problem waiting to happen (surely nylon could be substituted?) - these seals are not fitted at the factory with the care and aftercare they need (the steel reinforcement clearly breaks through the rubber if manhandled at assembly, which must be the case in my case).

Thankfully the aluminium roof has only surface rust marking (no paint bubbling), so the corrosion is confined to the seal. I think if it had been left rather longer the the painted aluminium would have been damaged.

As others have noted, the protective tape is only applied to the back and sides of the aluminium roof, and not to the front where the rust problems have arisen. In fact, I wonder if the steel reinforcement to the seal is only on the front section, anyway.

I also wonder whether black electrical tape (i.e. non conductive) all round the aluminium roof, to the full height of the seal would be a sensible improvement. It is additionally easier to shape than most tapes, being elastic.

Photos herewith:

View attachment 109099

View attachment 109100

View attachment 109101

View attachment 109102

View attachment 109103

nice write up ,

I’m glad this forum has given you the necessary skills and encouragement to check you seal & potentially save yourself some grief.

that’s a pretty bad failure of the seal, particularly on a “New” vehicle (7 months old )
edit; it just shows these vans leave the factory with already faulty seals

I can assure you the steel reinforcements extend round the entire seal, ( I have had experience of the rear showing rust ),
I think the front is prone to failure simply because the seal needs to be shaped to fit the roof profile and that very process of shaping and pressing the seal onto the roof edge is enough to break the very thin rubber cover of rubber over the steel reinforcing

the important thing is you have found the issue before it has caused damage and you now know how to check it regularly.

this just goes to show that the problem is still a real and ongoing issue as it has been for the entire Cali product run from T5 through to T6.1.

edit: The key is catching the corrosion early & replacing the seal ASAP, then check it regularly as part of the vehicle maintenance schedule

 

[SusiBus]

You're right Perfectos, every single California is vulnerable to this seal failure and subsequent roof corrosion since the very first T5 model. VW have been aware of the problem since the beginning, and chosen to ignore it. The waste, the aggravation. How have VW managed to inflict this stess on owners, but they have.

 

[Viktorgeorge]

Well, thank you, @Perfectos, however I was only following your (and others’) extensive lead on this.

I also note that I should point my dealer to ‘Workshop Action 75A1’ for the replacement seal. At £80, I am tempted to order a spare, do you know the VW part number by any chance?

 

[Perfectos]

Here is the part number.

VW CALIFORNIA T5 T6 2004-ON POP ROOF FRAME RUBBER SEAL 7E7875297​

 

[Brodger3]

Is the rust problem not a great opportunity for the aftermarket roof builders. What a PR event the launch of a repair kit for the VW Cali by Remo or such like.

You bought a VW factory made roof, now buy the repair kit from us. Our seals do not have any metal in them. They are stiff but flexible where needed and will never rust.

There must be a market there for them to make a good profit in developing a replacement.

The marketing opportunity and free press coverage would surely cover development costs.

 

[Viktorgeorge]

Is the rust problem not a great opportunity for the aftermarket roof builders. What a PR event the launch of a repair kit for the VW Cali by Remo or such like.

You bought a VW factory made roof, now buy the repair kit from us. Our seals do not have any metal in them. They are stiff but flexible where needed and will never rust.

There must be a market there for them to make a good profit in developing a replacement.

The marketing opportunity and free press coverage would surely cover development costs.

I had a similar thought, and planned to buy a spare, if I cannot keep the defective seal due to warranty return obligation, so I could investigate this with manufacturers. I looked on the web and found, for example:

Plastic and Foam Rubber Sheet Suppliers UK - AK Rubber

Specialist suppliers of plastic, foam and rubber sheets with the objective of supplying a complete cross-section of industry.

akrubber.co.uk

 

[Cali Phillip]

Here is the part number.

VW CALIFORNIA T5 T6 2004-ON POP ROOF FRAME RUBBER SEAL 7E7875297​

Looks like I need one, the rubber round the now rusty insert spit.
No rust on tape yet.

 

[yossarian]

Looks like the best value here.
Llparts seal

 

[HIGGINS]

Remove seal, waxoyl, replace!
Job done no rust issues

 

[Viktorgeorge]

Remove seal, waxoyl, replace!
Job done no rust issues

With the benefit of hindsight, I would have removed, Waxoyl packed and replaced the seal day 1.

I first used Waxoyl in 1969 as a 17 year old on my 1933 Austin 10 (bought for £20), and have been a fan ever since.

I suspect day 1 Waxoyl would have supressed any rust even if the rubber cover in the seal the the steel reinforcement was compromised at factory build stage (as mine appears to have been).

I am going to see what my VW dealer can offer, but, if it looks tortuous, I may just order a new £85 seal and Waxoyl DIY - thank you for that link @yossarian .

 

[HIGGINS]

I have had two cali,s, I have removed the seal from day one and waxoyled inside the seal where the metal is, then refitted the seal! Never had any problems!
I am awaiting delivery on a new Cali ocean in August/-) and I will be doing the exact same thing on day one!
Would rather do this than get the rust! Even if it means voiding the warranty on future seal problems?
Because from experience! Prevention is better than cure!

 

[Viktorgeorge]

I have had two cali,s, I have removed the seal from day one and waxoyled inside the seal where the metal is, then refitted the seal! Never had any problems!
I am awaiting delivery on a new Cali ocean in August/-) and I will be doing the exact same thing on day one!
Would rather do this than get the rust! Even if it means voiding the warranty on future seal problems?
Because from experience! Prevention is better than cure!

For anyone else following this string, I believe there is wisdom here ....

 

[andyinluton]

I have had two cali,s, I have removed the seal from day one and waxoyled inside the seal where the metal is, then refitted the seal! Never had any problems!

That sounds sensible, I think keep pulling the seal off to inspect is making things worse, there's only a very thin laver of rubber over the steel insert & every time its pulled off its risking scraping through the rubber.

I would go one step further than @HIGGINS & rather than refit the original, wax oil & fit a new seal.

I wish I knew what was different with the early 2015 MY vans, mine didn't have any sign at all of corrosion at 7 years old.

 

[yossarian]

Acf 50 used on various roof bolts

 

[HIGGINS]

Of course replace the seal of it is an old one? Why put a rusty old seal back on??

 

[HIGGINS]

I also apply the waxoyl, with a small brush, to all the roof bolts etc.
Guess what? Never had any rusty bolt problems)

 

[Viktorgeorge]

Acf 50 used on various roof bolts

View attachment 109158

Can you elaborate a little?

 

[yossarian]

Can you elaborate a little?

I went over all the easy to remove bolts in the roof. Most were rusty so treated with ACF 50.

 

[Viktorgeorge]

I went over all the easy to remove bolts in the roof. Most were rusty so treated with ACF 50.

But why are the bottoms rusted, I did not think they were external, or am I being thick?

 

[yossarian]

But why are the bottoms rusted, I did not think they were external, or am I being thick?

I was very surprised. Would never have removed these bolts if I hadn't' spotted this one.