California conversion to electric?

[Digger]

Im suprised the petrol hybrids are not an option now given current EU diesel legislation, makes the Cali à cleaner commuter and still reasonable camping range.

According to the green test results the T6 diesel is far greener than the petrol which throws out almost a third more CO2. Petrol is not the purest fuel.

 

[RodCouncil]

According to the green test results the T6 diesel is far greener than the petrol which throws out almost a third more CO2. Petrol is not the purest fuel.

Agreed but Governments policies against Diesel are criminal so VW should be offering all alternatives

 

[vmaxkiddy]

I personally think that the problem with a hybrid campervan is that hybrids make little sense unless you are regularly charging and doing short journeys with lots of recuperation. Hybrids typically have tiny electric ranges, much lower then electric vehicles. They are also heavier than their petrol/diesel equivalents so less fuel efficient running purely on those fuels. For regular long distance driving, it makes no sense.

A work mate of mine had a Porsche Cayenne hybrid for a while. It weighed around 2,400 kg (almost present Cali weight), around 300kg more than a non hybrid. Its hill climbing ability using electric only, was pathetic, and, on a good day the battery lasted 15 minutes.

 

[JohnGuppy]

My next Cali will be a diesel.

Ok, I have a bright yellow vignette on my windscreen for France, will probably pick one up for Germany, might have to think about what I do with my brand new Cali when it comes to 2035 but as it will be about 16-17 years old then I am not going to be too fussed about residuals ... if I could even remember what a Cali was given the age that I would be by then Well done I ag
Granny's guess for the future:

No one is seriously going to do anything to disrupt diesel traffic until there is a viable alternative.

2020: The T7 will be a hybrid.

2025: All electric will achieve a range of around 300 miles with fantastic new battery technology.

2026: Hydrogen fuel cells will make batteries redundant.

2030: Batteries will be banned as production is too polluting and disposal even more so: To make up for the gap in vehicle capacity the E10 diesel, now producing cleaner exhaust than the exhaled breath of the average human being, will be extended to 2050.

 

[GrannyJen]

I personally think that the problem with a hybrid campervan is that hybrids make little sense unless you are regularly charging and doing short journeys with lots of recuperation. Hybrids typically have tiny electric ranges, much lower then electric vehicles. They are also heavier than their petrol/diesel equivalents so less fuel efficient running purely on those fuels. For regular long distance driving, it makes no sense.

Hybrids make wonderful sense for the company car user unfortunately. The tax penalties for having use of a company car are horrendous but if you have a hybrid, even one that only derives 5% of it's energy from electric and still burns diesel or petrol predominantly, then it is much more benign. Why companies with big markets in company fleets, are rushing to produce hybrids.

 

[JohnGuppy]

i have spent the last 5 years trying to be green
Our Nissan Leaf is fine for 90 miles taking into account you will have air con and heater radio on. Call it 75 miles range. Then there is charge points. Half not working. Ones that are 15 amp charges. Take 4-5 hours to recharge The quick charges 30 mins. Now charge £1.50 Many car parks now charge to park

I took a trip from Hastings to Birmingham charging at service stations took us over 5 hours. As one charger was off line and only just made it

Most super markets have free charges but normal cars now use spaces for long term parking and are rude when you ask them not to park there
I now have a long lead and block them in if I have to

Nissan give me free. Recovery if I run out charge. And rale me to nearest charge point. One I have to sit at for 3 hours

I forgot it has a solar panel to charge the separate 12v battery to run dash and lights a legal requirement I am told

Once a year Nissian give me free. A loan car to go on holiday for two weeks

Battery packs. Cost. £4.5 k to replace. 5 year garentee. If falls below 80%
Car cost me. X demo. £15k

We have also a plug in pruis now that's a far better car
Plug in charger 30 mins. Gives us 15 miles. Wife goes 3 days to work and back on battery
Car does 75 mpg even better on motorways at 70
1800cc engine

Two years ago I purchased in a sale. Two electric scooters purchased by the environment agency to be used in London came with blue flashing lights. Horns phone kit. And message screen on the back. Saying stop , pull over etc
These cost the tax payer £13k each they came with no keys after sorting out keys and charging them up. One at done 4 miles and the other 43 miles I paid £600 for the pair
Range was 25-30miles. Hills less range but 4 years of not being used batteries are duff
I found a press cutting the two so called riders where equipped with ove £1000 of gear to wear

So don't worry there is no new battery that will give you 100s miles distance and already there is a worry lithium battery's are bad for us

That's why Tesla are selling battery storage packs for you house. But these are recycled packs from there cars a good way of getting ride of them

and as granny Jen says. VWT7 will be hybrid 4 4WD and poss plug in as well

 

[B J G]

Apparently the T6 is hybrid ready, but VW claimed there is no market. I am expecting a Hybrid version in a few years time which is why my van in on 3 year PCP.

http://www.caradvice.com.au/364081/...but-customers-arent-according-to-the-company/

Just confirms that until the van market wants a hybrid it won't be viable for VW to make it available on the Cali range.
Probably be a majority of new Cali's spec'd as such, providing the weight factor wasn't an issue.

 

[JohnGuppy]

We are all aware that you cannot store the 220v AC electricity in our homes and many people work 24/7 to make sure the nation grid is balanced so we never had black outs I am sure we all remember the coal strikes
A hydro generating station was built it wales to use surplus energy during the day to pump water to the top of a mountain its purpose was to be able to be bought on line at a very short notice , its purpose was around 7:45 pm was when the adds came on everyone rushed to put the kettle on for a cupa even today you will see you can make a cupa and return to watch the second half of your soap with the increase demand and the closing of power stations is becoming very difficult to control so our govement have come up with an idea
Lets pay people a grant if they are able to switch off there freezers at peak times for 10-15 mins to stop these peaks
Sounds a good idea as no harm would come to freezer's as they don't run all the time all you need is a connection to the grid you all ready have one yes ! most have wifi so a simple pug in device in the wall socket would control this

Just think of being told you cant charge your car at night because it will cost more and you can only charge your car when the wind blows or the sun shines

Just imagine 4 eclectic cars in a house hold all on charge 28Kw most houses don't have supplies in there house , then you would have to say in plug a car I want a shower

A motorway fast charger takes 50Kw for a 30min charge cant imagine another 100,000 50KW charges let alone 1 million 32amp supplies fitted in our homes

If every camp site owner gave you a 32amp supply at your pitch how much a one nights stay would be and most don't have the money to invest

I do think its wrong to be told things that will never happen and to panic people the wrong choices

 

[Morganic]

Why panic the Government are not going to give up on fossil fuel driven vehicles completely when they can bleed so much tax from the motorist to fund mad brained schemes. I'm going to drive my Cali into the ground and by then I'll be too old to drive!
I recently also read that the average domestic electrical system might be overloaded by some charging apparatus so much so that switching a kettle on whist charging will trip the switch.
And do you really think that electricity prices will be the same? The Government most likely will put tax on electricity used for charging motor vehicles
As one contributor has said get on and enjoy your Cali!!

 

[kaf2546]

I picture an electric Cali with small back up petrol engine just to charge the batteries like BMW i3, electric air heater, induction hob (gains a work surface) and solar roof as extra back up. Therefore no diesel or gas. Could have an electric water heater option for outside shower and take gas canister stove for outside cooking.

 

[Seán Kerr]

I picture an electric Cali with small back up petrol engine just to charge the batteries like BMW i3, electric air heater, induction hob (gains a work surface) and solar roof as extra back up. Therefore no diesel or gas. Could have an electric water heater option for outside shower and take gas canister stove for outside cooking.

I have an i3 but without the range extender, which suits me. I personally don't think the Cali will need a RE by the time an electric version is available. The rumoured i5 is meant to aiming for a 435 mile range and, by that time, charging will be faster and more readily available. Time will tell though!

 

[flying banana]

Sorry, I'm not sure what your point is, or at least, how it relates to EV campervans.

However for what it's worth... if you're just saying that it's dumb to build expensive (in carbon terms) frames on which to perch PV panels, and then to demolish the lot after just a few years, I'm sure no-one's going to disagree.

(But if you put your PV panels on a roof you're going to build anyway, or at least on a fit-for-purpose steel frame - steel has an embodied energy of only about 6,000 KWh per ton, while a 100 sq m PV array would generate about 250,000 KWh over a say 25 year lifespan in the UK, after a few years repaying its own embodied energy - then it makes a lot of sense.)

Just because some projects are stupidly conceived, or maybe just concept illustrations to grab some attention, doesn't mean that solar is a stupid technology.

Returning to the campervan question though, and EVs in general: you are claiming that EV's 'carry a greater pollution footprint than modern diesels'. I'm not saying you are wrong, but what is your actual basis for saying that?

lithium mining. battery life. disposal. shipping. they're my guesses. it's as stupid as importing bottled water from Fiji to a country where it's good out the tap

 

[flying banana]

my neighbour has an electric BMW I satsuma or whatever its called. he has it plugged in to his house. when I asked him what the range was he said 190 miles. ! no way was that lead long enough.

 

[Seán Kerr]

lithium mining. battery life. disposal. shipping. they're my guesses. it's as stupid as importing bottled water from Fiji to a country where it's good out the tap

Is that conclusion ('stupid') based on any particular study of the comparative total life environmental impact of electric vs combustion engined vehicles or just a list of all of the items you could think to place in the negative column?

 

[briwy]

lithium mining. battery life. disposal. shipping. they're my guesses. it's as stupid as importing bottled water from Fiji to a country where it's good out the tap

Yes and even dafter is importing woodchip from Norway and Canada to burn in power plants.

 

[flying banana]

Is that conclusion ('stupid') based on any particular study of the comparative total life environmental impact of electric vs combustion engined vehicles or just a list of all of the items you could think to place in the negative column?

what happens to batteries mate when they are knackered. and I'm not talking about the little ones that power the clock in the shed. a battery van would have a huge weight of battery packs in there. how much fossil fuel is burnt making the battery. mining the lithium I assume is not done with electric jcbs how much fossil fuel do massive ocean going ships pump through their crude huge heavy oil engines. and then there's charging the things. 32 amps supply needed and power stations burning fossil fuels to power the sockets. no facts but I reckon it's a waste of time

 

[Seán Kerr]

what happens to batteries mate when they are knackered. and I'm not talking about the little ones that power the clock in the shed. a battery van would have a huge weight of battery packs in there. how much fossil fuel is burnt making the battery. mining the lithium I assume is not done with electric jcbs how much fossil fuel do massive ocean going ships pump through their crude huge heavy oil engines. and then there's charging the things. 32 amps supply needed and power stations burning fossil fuels to power the sockets. no facts but I reckon it's a waste of time

So it was the latter. Yes, of course you are correct about the energy required to manufacture, transport and dispose of electric vehicles. It sounds like your conclusion is based on those factors alone and/or a gut feel. The total lifetime environmental impact of the vehicles is what matters, which includes the impact of manufacture, transportation, use and disposal. I'm interested to understand if you've seen or been involved in any studies that conclude that transitioning to electric vehicles will have a negative environmental impact vs combustion vehicles on that wider and more relevant basis.

 

[flying banana]

I work on railway mate. funny how they are now fitting brand new electric trains with 3 underslung diesel engines to drag around because apparently the wires are now seen as unsightly. what they mean is too costly

 

[flying banana]

stupid idea to convert a cali. but good debate

 

[flying banana]

bmw 116 d 83 mpg. Toyota prius mpg 64. plus battery manufacture and replacement every 5 year at least. no brainer what's best for the planet.and also how would an electric van be heated at night with no diesel parking heater? a great big oil radiator?be a big leisure battery to power that without hook up. it doesn't make sense on so many points it will never make sense while we are alive..well me anyway

 

[Seán Kerr]

I work on railway mate. funny how they are now fitting brand new electric trains with 3 underslung diesel engines to drag around because apparently the wires are now seen as unsightly. what they mean is too costly

bmw 116 d 83 mpg. Toyota prius mpg 64. plus battery manufacture and replacement every 5 year at least. no brainer what's best for the planet

A Prius is a hybrid, not fully electric. It has a combustion engine. Moving to electric vehicles will be better for the environment than combustion cars based on total environmental impact. No question and every single environmental body agrees. The i3 is significantly better than the 118d which, when studied in comparison by BMW (and independently verified by TUV SUD), was the Green Car of the Year.

 

[Seán Kerr]

 

[WelshGas]

Interesting - at present it is dark outside and very/very windy BUT
The local Solar Farm output is - 0 -

The local Wind Turbine Farm output is - 0 -, as they have all been switched Off as it is too windy.

So we're now on Gas/Oil/Coal and Woodchip power generation plus some Nuclear and Hydro generation.

 

[JohnGuppy]

And pooh power I expect WG. Have you seen the price of these BMW. I have a plug in Prius does over 70mpg cost £14 k s/h I am happy with performance
No good trying to save the planet. Someone will destroy it what ever we do or say
i can say if you buy an electric California. You will never be as happy as any T ? Owner

 

[JohnGuppy]

Just had a cold bath. As no sun today means cold water