Goodbye Brussels, hello Burnley.

[Digger]

Apologies for spelling mistakes above but using a new voice dictation software

 

[MattBW]

The statistics from the UK polls based on age brackets clearly shows that the 18-25 year old voters 75% voted remain.

As for people being wrong, that's the beauty of a democracy I have freedom of speech to disagree with those whose opinion differs to me. Wrong is like beauty, it's in the eye of the beholder.


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[fred]

The liberal elite ...will keep holding the same referendum until the population votes the way they want.

As i said on another thread we needed to vote out for them to come back with a better deal and they will!

You're both dreaming. It's over, the UK has made it's decision to pull the trigger of a loaded gun and leave the EU. Democracy has to be respected and the majority of people in the UK has democratically rejected Europe. We will have to invoke article 50, try and probably fail to prevent Scotland leaving, attempt to renegotiate with zero result as we have zero leverage. We may then choose to attempt to rejoin Europe under article 49 but:
- The UK's economy will be completely decimated financially
- Article 49 mandates that the UK adopt the Euro and free movement of goods, services and people
- there is no option of the UK negotiating a rebate on its proportionate contribution.

It's over. As I said many of us who have been subsidising the rest of the UK are mostly leaving.

 

[LowMan]

We were planning a Cali adventure up in Scotland over the next few months. After today's news, I think it'll become a search for a new home!

 

[estresao]

Funny that when the democratic right of the electorate does not agree with someone's opinion it must be wrong.
My nephew returned yesterday from Spain and the first thing that he did was to vote to leave the EU. He has lived and worked in Spain and has three very young children and when asked why his answer was that the Spanish people would vote to leave if they were given the opportunity as they feel that they political elite do not listen or care about them.
I personally find the arrogance of Junker and Hollande offensive. Their treatment of Cameron when he tried to negotiate was nothing less than disgraceful and I think that may have swayed many of the "middle-aged and perhaps others" to decide to leave as they also found the arrogance of this delete to be distasteful.
To say that the young are for the EU depends on who you ask. It is true that many of them mix with other students of other nationalities which is a great thing. Immigration is also good for the country. My issue with the EU and especially the EC is that it is unable to accept that the public have a right to object and demand changes. That is why it is failing. As it stands it is undemocratic as an elite should never have the arrogance to deny the people a right to self-determination.
I also personally hope that prior to anything happening they sit down and recognise their failure and offer an olive branch and real reform. If they fail to do so I honestly think that the people of Europe may also demand exit.
It is sad that this is happened and I do not think for one moment that responses will be balanced.

As a Spanish I agree with your nephew.

I like the idea of an European Union (or even a Earth Union.... why not) but as an union for the citizens rather for the markets. Spain have (had?) a good public health system, education systems, etc.... but according to our "beloved" politicians inheriting is about investors and market, and where there were good public services (paid by the citizens) now there is crap and the mantra is that we will have to pay (again) for private services.... obviously run by politicians colleagues.

If I had the chance to vote, I'd vote leave this EU.

The point is, it's possible to have another EU?

By confronting different countries' citizens only they win. If I had the chance to vote in Spain I'd vote "leave", but for sure not because the immigration (despite in Spain also exist the same mantra about people which come from abroad to steal our jobs, health system,etc....)

European politicians should think about that, but they are very happy with the current status, they never lose.

 

[snowy55]

We bought some cheese from a young man in a market in a tiny village in France today and he said he would vote out if given the chance, he said other counties would now follow our lead.

 

[LowMan]

As a Spanish I agree with your nephew.

I like the idea of an European Union (or even a Earth Union.... why not) but as an union for the citizens rather for the markets. Spain have (had?) a good public health system, education systems, etc.... but according to our "beloved" politicians inheriting is about investors and market, and where there were good public services (paid by the citizens) now there is crap and the mantra is that we will have to pay (again) for private services.... obviously run by politicians colleagues.

If I had the chance to vote, I'd vote leave this EU.

The point is, it's possible to have another EU?

By confronting different countries' citizens only they win. If I had the chance to vote in Spain I'd vote "leave", but for sure not because the immigration (despite in Spain also exist the same mantra about people which come from abroad to steal our jobs, health system,etc....)

European politicians should think about that, but they are very happy with the current status, they never lose.

I like your post Estresao. I really do. Some of the points you raise are thoughts I share deeply, especially that about Earth Union. However, I can't share your optimism that our 'Brexit' shared the same noble objectives. Especially when it's led by people as odious as Johnson, Gove and Farage.

Many of us will need significant convincing there isn't more sinister goals hidden behind their words. If I hear it from them three, it'll be a bigger shock than waking up to hear today's result!

 

[LowMan]

We bought some cheese from a young man in a market in a tiny village in France today and he said he would vote out if given the chance, he said other counties would now follow our lead.

People will tell you anything to sell cheese

 

[WelshGas]

The UK needs the EU and the EU the UK for trade, its not going away. However any agreemends like Norway has would still have many of the same requirements of membership but without any of the influence. Weaker position not better? I genuinely hope I'm proven wrong on my feelings on this.

The EU didn't need Norway as Norway needed the EU. Not quit the same with regards the UK!

 

[aileron346]

It truly is a disaster for the young who already feel bad about the way they have been treated by older generations who
In general have gone well. Many people have been completely taken in by far right politicians and the right-wing press but they will seriously rue the day. As for the '£350 million a week for the NHS', I hope Farage and the fools who believed him are reminded daily of this pledge. Sadly the disaffected poorer areas who have largely swing this vote stand to lose the most once Gove and Johnson get their way on things like the NHS. Britain has always done best with moderation but in economic stress has protest voted disasterously for extremists.


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[Digger]

It truly is a disaster for the young who already feel bad about the way they have been treated by older generations who
In general have gone well. Many people have been completely taken in by far right politicians and the right-wing press but they will seriously rue the day. As for the '£350 million a week for the NHS', I hope Farage and the fools who believed him are reminded daily of this pledge. Sadly the disaffected poorer areas who have largely swing this vote stand to lose the most once Gove and Johnson get their way on things like the NHS. Britain has always done best with moderation but in economic stress has protest voted disasterously for extremists.


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Who says that the elderly has treated the young badly? The elderly who are doing okay are those who work hard and made this country what it is. The reality is that the changing world with China taking most of the manufacturing has resulted in this downturn in opportunities. This has nothing at all to do with the older generation but to do with large corporations and politicians who are incompetent and basically don't care unless it suits them.
I have no political allegiance (I don't like any politician) but sometimes think those on the left despise everything to do with those on the right and vice versa. There seems to be no ability to see what is right for all and fairness for all. To say that Britain voted disastrously for extremists is way off the mark. The people voted for what they wanted end of story.
We are fed up with the political elite in the EU which appears totally inflexible and shows an arrogance beyond belief.
As stated before I hope they come to their senses in the EU and EC and step back from the catastrophe awaiting them. I don't think it's too late for them to reform and give the people back their freedom from oppressive political dictators.
Don't blame older generation as it is not they are doing but they are right to democratic process. These are the people who made the country. It is politicians and large corporations who have caused the damage.

 

[LowMan]

I'd say 'Britain voted disastrously for extremists' is actually bang on target!

 

[Digger]

I'd say 'Britain voted disastrously for extremists' is actually bang on target!

I don't think they voted for anyone just to leave the EU. I don't think for one minute my nephew or students care a jot about Farage et all. They just wanted to walk away from a federal EU

 

[LowMan]

I don't think they voted for anyone just to leave the EU. I don't think for one minute my nephew or students care a jot about Farage et all. They just wanted to walk away from a federal EU

I'm staggered by some commentary I've heard today. We weren't part of a Federal EU! A teeny part of me shares some sympathies with those who've sited pandering to big business etc, but they're deluded if they believe the people they're giving power too would do anything to stand in the way of them. Whether intentional or not, that's what they've done! Farage, Gove & Johnson are amongst the biggest supporters of further privatisation of the NHS rather than curbing corporate powers.

 

[fred]

I don't think they voted for anyone just to leave the EU. I don't think for one minute my nephew or students care a jot about Farage et all. They just wanted to walk away from a federal EU

We've heard a lot about what the Brexiteers don't like. And you've got your way.

So what's your plan for the UK now then?

 

[Digger]

I'm staggered by some commentary I've heard today. We weren't part of a Federal EU! A teeny part of me shares some sympathies with those who've sited pandering to big business etc, but they're deluded if they believe the people they're giving power too would do anything to stand in the way of them. Whether intentional or not, that's what they've done! Farage, Gove & Johnson are amongst the biggest supporters of further privatisation of the NHS rather than curbing corporate powers.

Quote from document (German)
The grand European vision aspires to a federalist state. It envisions countries giving up their sovereignty and statehood step by step, ultimately to be ruled by Brussels as the United States of Europe. That is a nice dream, but it hasn't been able to force its way into the real world. The British were never adherents of this dream.

Some have read deeply and decided that the federal state was coming and wanted no part. That is their right. If unhappy then so be it. Democracy means you accept the outcome. Don't vote don't complain. And if you lose be gracious.

 

[westfalia]

I hope it all comes tumbling down. Borders bac

We've heard a lot about what the Brexiteers don't like. And you've got your way.

So what's your plan for the UK now then?

Easy. Get rid of all the ´Pikeys´ knackers or whatever you want to call them.
That would be a good start.
I´d probably have a 10 point plan, that coming in the top 3, exporting foreign criminals
would be up there too.
give me a week and i´ll sort it for you.
Don´t be upset. It´s all good.

 

[fred]

can you even actually count up to 10?

 

[larrylamb]

I don't think for one minute my nephew or students care a jot about Farage et all

They might not but unfortunately millions do and this was their chance.

 

[westfalia]

can you even actually count up to 10?

All the way up to 12. Amazingly.
I´ll get my coat. This ain´t for me.

 

[Julian_Camper_Man]

Great day for some - bad day for most! Sums up how I feel really Mind-numbingly short-sighted

 

[Julian_Camper_Man]

Can we ditch the queen and her entourage now?

 

[Meoncoast]

We have made our bed now it is time to try and sleep in it.

 

[Skylark2.0]

We are in the UK at this time , hope they let us go back home using the ferry wednesday and not use us as hostages....

You can park on my drive any time!

 

[Skylark2.0]

Can we ditch the queen and her entourage now?

This is when she should invoke her control over parliament and bang there blooming heads together.