Discussion regarding T6 ONLY roof corrosion

[Jabberwocky]

More financial pressure on VW to cut costs not fix niggly problems!

I've just learnt today that a group of owners/interested parties are going to sue VW over the emissions issue. Its a "no win no fee" arrangement but the cost to anyone or body is 30% of any compensation granted by the courts.

 

[Grey one]

I am starting this thread so T6 owners and potential T6 owners are made aware that the T6 is subject to roof corrosion.



Here are 3 photos taken underneath the seal on the raising section of the roof on a May 2016 T6 California Beach taken today after our first trip away in her. .

Our much loved 2014 California SE was unsuccessfully repaired twice, the blistering quickly returned and it was booked in for a 3rd repair. We just could not bring ourselves to go through this all again and we made the difficult decision to part exchange it for the 2016 T6 Beach, thinking the problem had been cured. But obviously not!



So, our 2014 SE has it (three times), a loan 2015 SE had it and now our 2016 has it - the roof issue is still the same.

Remember folks when your warranty is up you're paying for your own repairs.



So yet again, we can either look forward to going to the dealers to register a fourth warranty claim for roof corrosion and then to go on a never ending list for an ineffectual repair but instead we are going to return the vehicle first thing in the morning and demand our money back! (See Consumer Right's Act 2015).



We have also cancelled the new T6 Beach we ordered on the 26th March, 2016 which is yet to be built!!!



Another VW will never darken our driveway again.

Can anyone assist with this general question? My dealer says that the warranty does not cover corrosion caused by perforation. Does corrosion of a type in the picture get asked

Unlikely, but if I got to the point of cancellation I would consider it to be the price of peace of mind

Please see my next post but in answer to the cancellation question, my particular dealer will do a full refund.

 

[snowy55]

Don't cancel - if you've decided to buy then stick with it. This doesn't happen to every single vehicle and Snowy's experience is probably at the extreme end of what can happen. Snowy - you have our sympathies and I fully understand your decisions (will we expect to hear an MP review any time soon?)

We have a 2014 vehicle from after they reckoned they've sorted the problem and no issues so far - madly touching wood here....

The Cali is a brilliant vehicle - just read some of Granny Jen's posts.

We've had experience of 3 different Calis built after the supposed fix in 2014 and all 3 had corrosion under the seal on the raising section of the roof.
Keep that piece of wood close at hand.

 

[Grey one]

Just heard back from VWCS re the specific question of what was done to the T6 to prevent the T5 issue happening again. They said the T5 issue was caused by a chemical reaction between paint and metal. Their words not mine. They also said that the T6 now has a zinc barrier between the metal and the paint. I have no idea how accurate those statements are or why the corrosion always appears in the same broad place as you would think a reaction would happen in various places?

 

[RoB5urf]

Anybody know if any roof changes were introduced for T6 MY17 ?

 

[snowy55]

Just heard back from VWCS re the specific question of what was done to the T6 to prevent the T5 issue happening again. They said the T5 issue was caused by a chemical reaction between paint and metal. Their words not mine. They also said that the T6 now has a zinc barrier between the metal and the paint. I have no idea how accurate those statements are or why the corrosion always appears in the same broad place as you would think a reaction would happen in various places?

Our 2014 SE was repainted twice with the high zinc content primer thats "cost hundreds of pounds a tin" and twice it failed to cure the problem with a rapid reoccurrence of the bubbles.

Presumably the 2016 T6 whose roof bubbles are at the beginning of this thread was sprayed at the factory with the high zinc content primer and that has obviously failed.

VWCS in all my dealings with them make the right noises but are very light on factual content - they haven't got a clue whats happening in the outside world.

 

[RichardP]

Totally disgraceful that such a new and expensive vehicle should have a problem that's be know about for so long. @snowy55 you have my sympathy, but why am I not surprised that this has occurred.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Apologies if this is old stuff but it's very new to me and the prospect of wading through 155 pages of an earlier thread of comments is more than a tad daunting.

I'm no chemist and I have not researched this matter that much but with a little digging and a few minutes reading and looking at what I see in photos and what I hear of the construction of the seals this issue is about contact between the steel in the roof edge seal and the aluminium roof. The paint layer, where the corrosion occurs, has somehow been breached to allow metal to metal contact or at the very least very close proximity. This metal to metal contact/close contact when wet (water/sea water/road salt etc) creates a galvanic cell and corrosion of the metals will take place. Unless contact between the two metals can be prevented the problem will continue. A zinc layer on the aluminium? Hmm, need to be a chemist to know if that will sort the corrosion problem because of differing levels of metallic nobility and their effect on each other but for me this sounds and feels like a solution to push the problem to a time outside the warranty period. Call me a cynic if you like. I do hope I am wrong.

A very interesting web site on Aluminium corrosion from the people who should know!! (if you can be bothered, interested to know or have the time!!

http://www.aluminiumdesign.net/design-support/aluminium-corrosion-resistance/#toc-galvanic-corrosion

 

[GrannyJen]

I am gutted for anyone with a corrosion problem, at the same time totally relaxed about my own cali.

To me it has always been something else other than a car and if it gets dirty, scratched, bashed or has paint defects to me, as long as the defects are not terminal or structurally impairing, then the time that I will worry about them will be when I pass the vehicle on.

I have not even checked below the rubber strip: if I even tried to lift it I would probably inflict terminal injury upon the roof itself. For me the value of the Cali is in the whole vehicle, the brilliant drive, the flexibility, the comfort and the irreplaceable, unique experiences that it allows me to enjoy.

However we are all different and when you spend a lot of money on what is purported to be a top-of-the-range vehicle, the best possible derivative, then you do not expect to have these problems. To have them therefore is bad enough, to have them accompanied with the arrogant, disdainful contempt that VW displays to it's customers is disgraceful.

@Calikev, he is right, VW do not have a fix for it, they really do not have to, there are more people wanting to buy a Cali than there are Cali's on the road probably. It will carry on just as it carried on with LR, when you buy a Landy you also bought 5 star, first-class, top-priced rust.

Whilst I am not particularly fussed about my own vehicle, I feel for those that are. It's a disgrace.

Despite this the Cali is still the best smile-per-mile vehicle out there.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Our 2014 SE was repainted twice with the high zinc content primer thats "cost hundreds of pounds a tin" and twice it failed to cure the problem with a rapid reoccurrence of the bubbles.

Presumably the 2016 T6 whose roof bubbles are at the beginning of this thread was sprayed at the factory with the high zinc content primer and that has obviously failed.

I think these observation/comments only go to support my conjecture that VW is just trying to push the problem to be outside the warranty period. A different seal with no metal bits would be a good starting point for a permanent solution as I think @Borris already suggested in an earlier post.

 

[thehorse]

Does anyone if the roof "scissors" that raise the roof are aluminium or steel? I guess at some point the roof has to be connected to the steel body. Is there any plastic bushing at the connection points?

 

[Jabberwocky]

@GrannyJen Thank you so much for those words. I needed for some one to sooth my brow!

In spite of all my gnashing of teeth today I will take delivery of my Cali when built (week4) - I am still excited as I have been all along since August last year.

I did browse the MB MP on the internet but could not bring myself to venture into an MB garage after all the emotion I have already invested into my new Cali. My god what will I be like when I have taken delivery!!

 

[GrannyJen]

@GrannyJen Thank you so much for those words. I needed for some one to sooth my brow!

In spite of all my gnashing of teeth today I will take delivery of my Cali when built (week4) - I am still excited as I have been all along since August last year.

I did browse the MB MP on the internet but could not bring myself to venture into an MB garage after all the emotion I have already invested into my new Cali. My god what will I be like when I have taken delivery!!

I doubt that you will be disappointed. It is a truly brilliant vehicle. All credit to the MB Marco Polo but for me it's too long, if I was going to buy something that length then it would be a LWB VW with a bog built in. It also simply does not have that built for "rugged" purpose looks and feel that a Cali has.

Now, a funny story to cheer you up.

For two years I have been seeing a Grey Cali parked up in Worthing or Goring, near my home. Whenever I see a Cali I pop a calling card under the windscreen.

Today I was at the dentists, having my teeth cleaned, just like an old nag. I saw this Cali pull up outside, then disappear into the rear of the building. Out popped the dentist who looks after all my vanity bits, crowns etc.

"I never knew you owned a Cali! Are you in the VW Cali club"?

"No I'm not but some bugger keeps leaving cards under my windscreen!. Bloody nuisance! Keep thinking I've got a ticket! Are you in that club?"

"oh. Yes, I am a member, only an occasional, quiet one of course...... now, about my loose veneer......."

 

[Grey one]

@GrannyJen Thank you so much for those words. I needed for some one to sooth my brow!

In spite of all my gnashing of teeth today I will take delivery of my Cali when built (week4) - I am still excited as I have been all along since August last year.

I did browse the MB MP on the internet but could not bring myself to venture into an MB garage after all the emotion I have already invested into my new Cali. My god what will I be like when I have taken delivery!!

Good call. I will also take possession of mine next week and start using it within days on a trip to the New foredt. It's under warranty and won't fall apart!

 

[Meoncoast]

I checked under the rubber roof seal on our T5 and I am sure after pulling it off it was a lot looser and allowed water between the seal and the roof which I am sure can not help the problem. When it was repaired it was fitted tight and I left it well alone.(as I did not want to add water to the mix). For me the front panel was a far more unsightly problem over the few bubbles under the rubber seal. I am with GJ on Cali fun

Despite this the Cali is still the best smile-per-mile vehicle out there.

 

[Jabberwocky]

I doubt that you will be disappointed. It is a truly brilliant vehicle. All credit to the MB Marco Polo but for me it's too long, if I was going to buy something that length then it would be a LWB VW with a bog built in. It also simply does not have that built for "rugged" purpose looks and feel that a Cali has.

Now, a funny story to cheer you up.

For two years I have been seeing a Grey Cali parked up in Worthing or Goring, near my home. Whenever I see a Cali I pop a calling card under the windscreen.

Today I was at the dentists, having my teeth cleaned, just like an old nag. I saw this Cali pull up outside, then disappear into the rear of the building. Out popped the dentist who looks after all my vanity bits, crowns etc.

"I never knew you owned a Cali! Are you in the VW Cali club"?

"No I'm not but some bugger keeps leaving cards under my windscreen!. Bloody nuisance! Keep thinking I've got a ticket! Are you in that club?"

"oh. Yes, I am a member, only an occasional, quiet one of course...... now, about my loose veneer......."

Great story Jen! Thanks.

For what its worth I did spend some time on a Merc Vito/Class V forum this afternoon. Full of familiar stuff, auto gear box, wiring, brakes issues etc. even one comment that started "Well my V Class has kept going for the last ten minutes today"! Grass on other side etc Maybe not that green! I agree with you about length too. Just too long for everyday.

Thanks again JW

 

[zeratul]

Not good news. I have one of the last T5.2's and thought I'd be safe...
How many years is the VW warranty for roof corrosion? Guess I'll wait as long as possible for a fix, to increase the hope of them sorting this out properly .. if I have the issue of course..

 

[thehorse]

Snowy - out of interest did you take the Cali back this morning. If so what did the dealer say?

 

[Digger]

Apologies as off topic but have to say I admire GJ. She personifies a true Cali owner. Now will run and hide

 

[snowy55]

Snowy - out of interest did you take the Cali back this morning. If so what did the dealer say?

We emailed the dealer Sunday afternoon, and by 12.30 today we had agreed that they come and collect it tomorrow (Tuesday) at 10.30 with a full refund.

 

[Stoneybroke]

Just heard back from VWCS re the specific question of what was done to the T6 to prevent the T5 issue happening again. They said the T5 issue was caused by a chemical reaction between paint and metal. Their words not mine. They also said that the T6 now has a zinc barrier between the metal and the paint. I have no idea how accurate those statements are or why the corrosion always appears in the same broad place as you would think a reaction would happen in various places?

Is there any correlation between Cali Colours/finishes and the blistering?

 

[Smiffy4bikes]

@GrannyJen Thank you so much for those words. I needed for some one to sooth my brow!

In spite of all my gnashing of teeth today I will take delivery of my Cali when built (week4) - I am still excited as I have been all along since August last year.

I did browse the MB MP on the internet but could not bring myself to venture into an MB garage after all the emotion I have already invested into my new Cali. My god what will I be like when I have taken delivery!!

JW, this is a truly difficult subject, and for Snowy55 and others who have had endless problems with the roof corrosion issue, it must be devastating. I can't imagine how they must all be feeling right now, and I am in no way attempting to diminish their angst with this post.

However, for me, like you, I have been waiting months for my Cali to arrive, and am beyond excited about collecting it next week I have spent all those months dreaming, planning and anticipating the lifetime of memories I know this vehicle will give to me and mine.

Is the corrosion issue acceptable? No. Have VW behaved correctly and fairly to their customers? No. Will they in the future? Probably not. Am I worried about my Cali? Yes, mildly. Will it stop me buying it? Hell NO.

If I were to cancel my order tomorrow, I can absolutely guarantee on my children's lives that within 48hrs someone else will have the keys to the dream machine that I have saved for and waited for all these years. They will be in happy land and I will be as miserable as sin, as will be my kids.

This corrosion issue won’t be going away anytime soon. But, I’m an optimist. It’s a brand new vehicle. Its under warranty. I will have a chat with my dealer about it next week, let him know that I know. It won’t stop me driving it, loving it, living in it, having endless adventures in it.

It's a Campervan. Within a week the kids will have scratched the paintwork with their school bags and the idiot in Tesco’s car park will have dinged the door, and yes, I will be upset, very upset I’m sure (!) but, every time I drive it, it will make me smile.

Granny Jen is right, these are truly awesome vehicles. Don’t cancel your order, live the dream

 

[thehorse]

We emailed the dealer Sunday afternoon, and by 12.30 today we had agreed that they come and collect it tomorrow (Tuesday) at 10.30 with a full refund.

Good they did the honourable thing.

I'm guessing they spoke to VW who probably wanted this resolving quickly to try and contain any discontentment on your behalf. Last thing they want is things like this leaking to an internet forum! Oops too late!

Good luck with whatever replacement you go for.

 

[Jabberwocky]

JW, this is a truly difficult subject, and for Snowy55 and others who have had endless problems with the roof corrosion issue, it must be devastating. I can't imagine how they must all be feeling right now, and I am in no way attempting to diminish their angst with this post.

However, for me, like you, I have been waiting months for my Cali to arrive, and am beyond excited about collecting it next week I have spent all those months dreaming, planning and anticipating the lifetime of memories I know this vehicle will give to me and mine.

Is the corrosion issue acceptable? No. Have VW behaved correctly and fairly to their customers? No. Will they in the future? Probably not. Am I worried about my Cali? Yes, mildly. Will it stop me buying it? Hell NO.

If I were to cancel my order tomorrow, I can absolutely guarantee on my children's lives that within 48hrs someone else will have the keys to the dream machine that I have saved for and waited for all these years. They will be in happy land and I will be as miserable as sin, as will be my kids.

This corrosion issue won’t be going away anytime soon. But, I’m an optimist. It’s a brand new vehicle. Its under warranty. I will have a chat with my dealer about it next week, let him know that I know. It won’t stop me driving it, loving it, living in it, having endless adventures in it.

It's a Campervan. Within a week the kids will have scratched the paintwork with their school bags and the idiot in Tesco’s car park will have dinged the door, and yes, I will be upset, very upset I’m sure (!) but, every time I drive it, it will make me smile.

Granny Jen is right, these are truly awesome vehicles. Don’t cancel your order, live the dream

Yo! Thanks for great words - helps me focus on a balance of my current emotions.

That said, I have already reached the right solution......not cancelling - will live the dream! Have been planning trip to Netherlands earlier tonight for April/May before going on to France for June and July. Some stuff for the Cali being delivered tomorrow in readiness!
Thanks again. JW

 

[sidepod]

Out of interest, exactly how many of you worried people will take action and find a replacement seal strip without a metal insert?

Or will you sit and wait/hope?