4Motion or not?

[GrannyJen]

Each to there own:

The running costs? Well, Albert, now Alfie, gave me the confidence to venture where others may not tread. For me, those moments, are priceless, a value way beyond what it costs at 2-3 mpg more, or the extra cost of ownership less residuals.

One moment, a moment in many, sticks out. Loch Carron. February 2015. Ice and snow everywhere. A vehicle gone off road almost making it impassable and the police enforcing a 70 mile detour. Albert, in a long queue, waiting to turn round, a huddled conversation with the policeman, "Winter tyres on a 4WD? OK, Try and get through if you want, your risk....." and me trundling past this long line, up a bank, a bit steep, snow deep, a bit of a backslide, just coaxing him past the overturned vehicle... so sure footed, such a feeling of being in control, instant smugness at 2-3 hours saved and yet again what an impressive go anywhere, live anywhere, fly to the freedom zone vehicle that I have.

Why I call it my comfort zone. You can never predict these situations, just know when they arise that you can probably deal with them.

 

[Jay20cali]

I really don’t get these types of debates. I wonder if, somewhere, there is a Rolls Royce club where they argue the merits of Ghost vs Phantom or saloon vs drop-head? I have £20k’s worth of 214 BHP Superbike that spends 90% of its life locked in my garage. For 90% of the remaining 10% I could do exactly the same things on a bike with half the power and at less than 25% of the price. But that final one percent is very special. Does that make any kind of financial sense? No. Of course not. I should sell the bike and the van and invest in a sensible retirement plan. But, you know.what? I might be dead tomorrow. Spend your money exactly how you choose. As long as you can justify it to yourself, enjoy it. Now where did I put the bike keys...

Love this ....I got stuff I should’ve sold because I don’t use it at all but I haven’t (why) because I don’t want too if I sold It even though I don’t use it I’d miss it......
I’d love a 4motion not sure I’d use it apart from once a year in the alps or maybe venturing onto that wet muddy pitch but I’d love one nether the less,if I didn’t have a budget I would most definitely order one..

 

[John Slater]

Got our previous T5 conversion stuck a few times in muddy parking fields and on forest roads mostly at orienteering events. We also live in the sticks in the Lakes. So 4Motion was a preferred option this time around. Our 9 month old (1700 miles) ex-VW management Cali 150 Ocean 4Motion seemed a very good price so we bought it. Had I been speccing new or going for a conversion again it would've been a more difficult choice. Happy knowing it's doing it's job quietly whenever required...And we don't have the same domestics when parking off-road now!

 

[Ksar-el-kebir]

Got our previous T5 conversion stuck a few times in muddy parking fields and on forest roads mostly at orienteering events. We also live in the sticks in the Lakes. So 4Motion was a preferred option this time around. Our 9 month old (1700 miles) ex-VW management Cali 150 Ocean 4Motion seemed a very good price so we bought it. Had I been speccing new or going for a conversion again it would've been a more difficult choice. Happy knowing it's doing it's job quietly whenever required...And we don't have the same domestics when parking off-road now!

I’ve got 4motion with diff lock and VB air suspension; never got stuck anywhere. There’s a video of a 4motion with diff lock on YouTube getting off a muddy bank; what a goer!

 

[Exige]

I was considering buying a 4Motion, but was put off by the dealer who said that not really needed & most people never actually go off road with their Cali's. I agreed & just went for the 2 wheel drive version. In the 2 years since buying however I have regretted not going for the 4Motion on a number of occasions, including numerous snow covered alpine roads, muddy campsite fields & lastly having to be towed out of a festival by tractor!! That said we have survived!

 

[soulstyledevon]

Ok
My last van was the 140bhp Beach 2wd
My current van is the 204bhp Ocean 2wd.

The 204bhp spins it’s wheels far to easily and I think DSG doesn’t help with this issue either. Less control with DSG than with a manual. I think 200bhp in a front wheel drive van is a tad excessive.

So, if I was replacing my van tomorrow and it was the 204 DSG. I would tick the 4M box.
Now, if I was after the 150bhp mule, I would perhaps forgo 4M

 

[Norfolk Jim]

I'm reading this all with interest as currently I own Colin a 2007 T5 Leisuredrive Conversion with 105 bhp. Now I also own a 2011 Nissan X Trail (which will go with Colin when I find the ideal Cali) which has a fantastic system. You can leave in 2WD and if by chance you get into a serious slippery situation in a bend (dry road to sudden wet slippery) it will quickly switch to 4WD. Most folk leave it in auto which is 4WD and let it do what it wants quietly but when serious off roading (it will go literally anywhere) you can switch to diff lock. Now that's the system and when in 4WD auto (which I assume is like the 4motion) it only seems to reduce mpg by some 2 - 3 mpg which isn't much in grand scheme of things. So here's the good bit I can drive the same vehicle in either 2WD or 4WD to give direct comparison. In T5 I have occasionally found on roads with long ruts caused by HGV's it can be fun when accelerating and trying to keep van straight line - scary sometimes on dual carriageway with cars passing (by the way all 4 tyres - Continentals - only done 4k and full 4 wheel alignment done). A particular part of A11 near Thetford is bad. Now the other day I went along same section in X Trail in 2 wheel drive and accelerating v quickly from roundabout in 2WD the car started twitching in the ruts (my X Trail is tuned with 221hp) but held ok; I was shocked (again tyres nearly new Vredestein Quatrax All season) and puzzled so went back and switched into 4WD Auto and did the same - night and day - hard acceleration and car on same line didn't twitch at all as if no ruts! I have found leaving it in 4WD makes it more sure footed when road surface is not good. I can see all the arguments for and against but who coasts round corners anyway??? Surely most will accelerate out of a corner so for sure footedness I'd say 4M is best. Interesting to see people saying about putting All season or winter tyres on 2WD Cali's if it's for winter use you'll also need the same tyres on 4Motion as that will be useless in snow and ice with summer tyres on even with 4WD. I will miss my X Trail but the Cali will become my daily drive so I am being v particular - my twopenceworth

 

[No_heroes]

Ok
My last van was the 140bhp Beach 2wd
My current van is the 204bhp Ocean 2wd.

The 204bhp spins it’s wheels far to easily and I think DSG doesn’t help with this issue either. Less control with DSG than with a manual. I think 200bhp in a front wheel drive van is a tad excessive.

So, if I was replacing my van tomorrow and it was the 204 DSG. I would tick the 4M box.
Now, if I was after the 150bhp mule, I would perhaps forgo 4M

Good call. My only experience with the 2WD was the 204 bhp DSG and it felt definitely too much power for the drivetrain- at least for my driving. Throw in poor driving surface and it was daily wheel spins. I think the lower power manual 2WD or the higher power DSG 4motion seem to the the sensible options.

 

[soulstyledevon]

Good call. My only experience with the 2WD was the 204 bhp DSG and it felt definitely too much power for the drivetrain- at least for my driving. Throw in poor driving surface and it was daily wheel spins. I think the lower power manual 2WD or the higher power DSG 4motion seem to the the sensible options.

I think VW should be making the 204 and 4 motion a combined package...

 

[Sandyvan]

I think VW should be making the 204 and 4 motion a combined package...

Then they would have to add the third rail for customers who require the fifth seat.

 

[Gunslinger1976]

You will have many opinions saying it’s not worth the added expense unless you plan to drive off-road regularly or go skiing etc: and most of these comments will be from owners who don’t have 4Motion.
The California, with the correct tyres, is a very capable vehicle in FWD form, especially in the U.K.
I use mine all year round and , enjoy driving interesting roads and although not a speed freak intend to keep up with the masses or lead the way and don’t spend my life in the slow lane.
Audi made the Quattro for a reason and it wasn’t for Off-roading. The 4Motion is more planted, no wheel spin, and equal tyre wear all round and generally a better driving experience, in my opinion.
After 27,000 miles all 4 tyres show tread depths of 4.9mm +/- 0.13 mm.
Will I buy again, Yes, even if I forgo LED headlights , twin-tone or other options. It will be the first option following engine size.

Totally agree with this regarding the advantages and reasons to go with 4Motion. I would add that anyone used to driving RWD is unlikely to appreciate the feeling of torque steer (the steering wheel trying to pull to the straight position under acceleration) from the FWD model.

That said, the decrease in fuel economy and additional servicing costs (Haldex oil change every 3 years) can’t be ignored as well as the obvious large increase in initial purchase price.

 

[B J G]

Totally agree with this regarding the advantages and reasons to go with 4Motion. I would add that anyone used to driving RWD is unlikely to appreciate the feeling of torque steer (the steering wheel trying to pull to the straight position under acceleration) from the FWD model.

That said, the decrease in fuel economy and additional servicing costs (Haldex oil change every 3 years) can’t be ignored as well as the obvious large increase in initial purchase price.

Haldex oil change isn't expensive cost to factor in. £70ish at 40K miles or as you wish.

 

[babble]

So, I've just picked up my new 4Motion 150 Beach (and very happy i am about it too). If i have it regularly serviced with VW, will they do the haldex oil without me asking, or do i need to prompt them for that? Is there anything else i should know / do in terms of maintenance? Request any chaning of filters or pumps or anything? Also, i have the rear diff-lock - do i need to use it every now and then and/or undertake any additional servicing? Thanks!!

 

[RockinNRollin]

Any servicing should be done in line with the schedule; however, note that the manufacturer schedules are not always appropriate (many makes will say for example gearbox oil is "for the life of the vehicle" when in reality it's good to change it every 50k miles).

Rear diff lock; if it's a genuine mechanical diff lock, don't use it on the road unless it's snowy/muddy and you're struggling for grip as around corners the inside and outside wheels on an axle will turn differing amounts (hence the reason for a diff in the first place); a proper diff lock stops that so in low traction conditions both wheels turn equally rather than one spinning away. In high traction conditions, something will have to give instead . . . tyres probably, but the diff will take a fair load too! Not sure if the Cali system is a true diff lock or an e-diff (i.e. using selective braking to arrest a spinning wheel).

Back to the 2WD vs 4Motion discussion; I was astounded how well the 2WD Cali we hired dealt with leaf-strewn steep muddy lanes in Devon - I was genuinely expected it to just grind to a halt but it seemed unfazed.

 

[B J G]

So, I've just picked up my new 4Motion 150 Beach (and very happy i am about it too). If i have it regularly serviced with VW, will they do the haldex oil without me asking, or do i need to prompt them for that? Is there anything else i should know / do in terms of maintenance? Request any chaning of filters or pumps or anything? Also, i have the rear diff-lock - do i need to use it every now and then and/or undertake any additional servicing? Thanks!!

Not part of normal service. I had to add to 6 year service as not due on VW plan. Don't think that they clean filter/strainer which is advised by independent sources.

 

[Corradobrit]

My Audi S4 required a haldex oil filter change every 36K miles. It was a bear to get to hence the high cost of about $650. Hopefully the VW unit is a bit more accessible and that will reduce the shop hours and this cost. Def replace the filter at the same time.

 

[AndrewCook680]

On my Golf R the haldex filter isn’t replaceable, but I have removed it from pump and cleaned it every couple years and changed oil. Vw have serviced it too, but they just change the oil. The filter can clog up and lead to the pump burning out

 

[Tarquers]

Any servicing should be done in line with the schedule; however, note that the manufacturer schedules are not always appropriate (many makes will say for example gearbox oil is "for the life of the vehicle" when in reality it's good to change it every 50k miles).

Rear diff lock; if it's a genuine mechanical diff lock, don't use it on the road unless it's snowy/muddy and you're struggling for grip as around corners the inside and outside wheels on an axle will turn differing amounts (hence the reason for a diff in the first place); a proper diff lock stops that so in low traction conditions both wheels turn equally rather than one spinning away. In high traction conditions, something will have to give instead . . . tyres probably, but the diff will take a fair load too! Not sure if the Cali system is a true diff lock or an e-diff (i.e. using selective braking to arrest a spinning wheel).

Back to the 2WD vs 4Motion discussion; I was astounded how well the 2WD Cali we hired dealt with leaf-strewn steep muddy lanes in Devon - I was genuinely expected it to just grind to a halt but it seemed unfazed.

Just had a service and the VW tech advised they were doing the haldex oil change as routine.

 

[Californication69]

My Audi S4 required a haldex oil filter change every 36K miles. It was a bear to get to hence the high cost of about $650. Hopefully the VW unit is a bit more accessible and that will reduce the shop hours and this cost. Def replace the filter at the same time.

There’s a YouTube video on how to remove & clean the Haldex unit filter on a California. As long as you are fit and healthy and access to wheel ramps and axel stands looks easy enough

 

[Californication69]

Any servicing should be done in line with the schedule; however, note that the manufacturer schedules are not always appropriate (many makes will say for example gearbox oil is "for the life of the vehicle" when in reality it's good to change it every 50k miles).

Rear diff lock; if it's a genuine mechanical diff lock, don't use it on the road unless it's snowy/muddy and you're struggling for grip as around corners the inside and outside wheels on an axle will turn differing amounts (hence the reason for a diff in the first place); a proper diff lock stops that so in low traction conditions both wheels turn equally rather than one spinning away. In high traction conditions, something will have to give instead . . . tyres probably, but the diff will take a fair load too! Not sure if the Cali system is a true diff lock or an e-diff (i.e. using selective braking to arrest a spinning wheel).

Back to the 2WD vs 4Motion discussion; I was astounded how well the 2WD Cali we hired dealt with leaf-strewn steep muddy lanes in Devon - I was genuinely expected it to just grind to a halt but it seemed unfazed.

Wait till you drive a 4Motion, I wrote a whole page on how much better it feels and drives than a 2WD.
(I’ve ran a 2WD for 7 months and 7k miles in 2020/21

 

[B J G]

There’s a YouTube video on how to remove & clean the Haldex unit filter on a California. As long as you are fit and healthy and access to wheel ramps and axel stands looks easy enough

Getting the cable unplugged to enable filter removal looked difficult.
I haven't tried as yet but when I had a Remap the Guy gave uo. (only had a 2 wheel rolling road)

 

[RockinNRollin]

Wait till you drive a 4Motion, I wrote a whole page on how much better it feels and drives than a 2WD.
(I’ve ran a 2WD for 7 months and 7k miles in 2020/21

Not sure I'll get that opportunity as we've got a 2WD on order, but I did own a turbo Subaru Forester (an SG from 2007 before they went all soft) so can appreciate what proper AWD is like.