Diesel ban 2030

Just because Boris says it does not mean it will happen. Remember some of his other ideas... A Brexit deal that is good for the UK. A bridge/ tunnel from Scotland to Ireland. A world beating track and trace system. It all BS.
Nothing wrong with carrying out a feasibility study regarding a bridge or tunnel to the island of Ireland, after all we have Euro tunnel to France. Nothing has yet been finalised with the EU and as far as Track & Trace is concerned then you need to read a little more about the problems other Western countries are having with their Test, Track & Trace systems. Unfortunately or Fortunately, in the present situation, Western Democracies are much more Liberal and take account of individual human rights compared with some Eastern countries.
 
Congratulations on placing you order, super exciting!

I have no idea how old you are, but I (48) for one am not going to worry about what a Government may, or may not, do in 9 years time. They don't even know what they are doing in 9 days time at the moment!

I have heard of too many people recently who have departed this earth far earlier than they were expecting. We got our 6.1 in July this year, kids are 8 & 6, we are having a blast. Even on Saturday night we grabbed a takeaway pizza from Zizzi and sat in the van! Brilliant. Can't do that in my wife's A3!

Resale value? There are millions of diesel cars so we are all in the same boat, apart from your Cali will lose far less than any other vehicle. If you want to work out real money then look at the cost of renting a Cali for, say, a month per year but you won't be doing day trips because it is too much faff to rent for a day.

All the family are utterly in love with our van. Just go for it! Sorry to sound morbid but you really do not know what is around the corner.
 
Congratulations on placing you order, super exciting!

I have no idea how old you are, but I (48) for one am not going to worry about what a Government may, or may not, do in 9 years time. They don't even know what they are doing in 9 days time at the moment!

I have heard of too many people recently who have departed this earth far earlier than they were expecting. We got our 6.1 in July this year, kids are 8 & 6, we are having a blast. Even on Saturday night we grabbed a takeaway pizza from Zizzi and sat in the van! Brilliant. Can't do that in my wife's A3!

Resale value? There are millions of diesel cars so we are all in the same boat, apart from your Cali will lose far less than any other vehicle. If you want to work out real money then look at the cost of renting a Cali for, say, a month per year but you won't be doing day trips because it is too much faff to rent for a day.

All the family are utterly in love with our van. Just go for it! Sorry to sound morbid but you really do not know what is around the corner.
Great post!

Good to hear you are having so much fun with your van. We are waiting for ours (build week starts 30th Nov) and really can't wait - our kids are 7 and 10 :) Day or short weekend trips are what I am looking forward to the most.
 
Nothing wrong with carrying out a feasibility study regarding a bridge or tunnel to the island of Ireland, after all we have Euro tunnel to France. Nothing has yet been finalised with the EU and as far as Track & Trace is concerned then you need to read a little more about the problems other Western countries are having with their Test, Track & Trace systems. Unfortunately or Fortunately, in the present situation, Western Democracies are much more Liberal and take account of individual human rights compared with some Eastern countries.
Boris and Co. are so incompetent they would probably build a bridge from Scotland to England ...
 
The ban is only for new vehicles sold after 2030.

Buy the dream of your life and get out and about to make great memories.

In my view 2030 is an aspiration. It will slip.

But will probably mean that the costs of running a petrol or diesel vehicle will increase.....after all, the government still needs the tax revenue to come in.

The road tax tends to stay at the rate of when the vehicle was first purchased, so buy now before the hikes!

Looks like 2030 will remain. UK is meeting its own 2025 target for closing Coal fired power stations (rest of Europe is by 2030). UK Push for more Nuclear continues, alongside windfarms etc (buy some VESTAS shares)

You will still be able to buy diesel / petrol after 2030, its just the sale of new cars that will change; Supply of fuel is a huge industry, will impact many jobs so would take many years after 2030 to be fully electric.

Problem with raw material supply for batteries still remains, but the large mining firms when required have the ability for local problems to be solved quickly by siding with the local governments.

Personally I think that the electric supply for cars will eventually be on a higher tariff to your home, that way the government can tax it at a higher rate to your home consumption. I can't see the government loading the tax on diesel / petrol as many lower income families will not be able to afford the additional tax, or, have cash to buy a new electric car.

We shall see!
 
I''ll worry about 2030 in about December 2029
Now is probably the best time to buy as you will get at least 10 worry free years, Diesel isn't just going to disappear overnight so give it at least another 5 years. So make that 15 years of use. After that I reckon I will be thinking of part exchanging it for a zimmer frame.
 
Don’t know why there is so much outrage, it was inevitabl. All the PM has done is give you all heads up, industry needs to meet the challenge. If a deadline isn’t set we wouldn’t have any traction. It’s not political any government would of got it to do. Who is goI got to tell the worlds biggest polluters to fall in line is the real challenge.

besides once I am done with the Cali my next purchase is more than likely a mobility scooter.... if I live that long.
 
We have just ordered our and I am on the same boat...10 years is a long time and many adventures away. And diesel cars will not just disappear in 2030. The resale value may go down but on the other hand it may actually go up depending on how good/reliable/expensive electric vehicles (campervans) will be by 2030...
 
Memories don't adhere to Government guidelines. Make them now and enjoy for as long as you can. :thumb:thumb
As has already been said non of us know what is round the corner and Covid-19 is a living testament to that!
 
Too far away to be of any realistic concern, in 10+ years time a Cali bought now will be retiring, if well used, or still as practical as ever.

This will be an ever increasing decision towards the end of the decade but hopefully by then the direction of vehicle power source will be stabilised, electric or hydrogen.

Not much more than 10 years since The Government was promoting Diesel power.

Talk of ending Gas Boilers use as well, will Gaz be banned leaving a useless gas hob in Cali's?

Think that I'll just keep mine until............, saves making a decision and there might be an attractive scrappage scheme coming along.
 
in 10+ years time a Cali bought now will be retiring,
You best not say that to all the T2, 3 4 and 5 owners. Cali's hold their value because (1) conversions cost so much to build and (2) because they have (have had) 30+ years of life.

Cali's have been depreciating at around £2k a year. If you take a £70k Cali and only give it 10 years, your annual drop is going to be higher than that.

So the diesel threat to residual values of campers is very real, but there's frankly not much you can do about it. If possibly taking a big hit on depreciation isn't a problem, then all is well. If taking a big hit would be a problem, you can have all the same fun in a £20k van as you can a £70k one. If mine depreciates £2k a year over 10 years I'll be down to zero anyway.
 
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Life is to short to worry about 10 years down the road. If you use your van as its designed to be used it wont owe you anything in 10 years time, and you will have had much bigger adventures on the way. In reality it may still be worth the cost of a new electric car!!
 
I wonder if the ICE car factories and tooling will be sold off to India/Africa
 
I think that if they do make a viable electric camper it going to be very expensive and will have some big compromises (it will be heavy and the range won't be great).

Not that I wouldn't have the same worries but I don't see decent affordable electric alternatives to the California appearing within the next 5 years.
 
Too far away to be of any realistic concern, in 10+ years time a Cali bought now will be retiring, if well used, or still as practical as ever.

Think that I'll just keep mine until............, saves making a decision and there might be an attractive scrappage scheme coming along.
Italy a while back tried a camper scrapping scheme to get the old diesel campers off the road, didn’t work too well due the the price disparity to new.

Most of the old campers owners are retired and the Italian pension is not very generous and anyway most campers are only used max 2 times per year Easter and summer so the rational seems a bit off.
 
Hi all. This is my first time posting but I have been following for a few months since placing an order for a new VW California, due in March 2021. In light of the plan to bring forward the ban on new diesel and petrol vehicles in 2030, do people think this is not a good idea now?

Sold our 25 year old T4 Westfalia camper van last year. Made a profit. We'd owned it for quite some time. I wouldn't worry about getting a brand new one now. In time you might have trouble getting into big cities perhaps. But even that will take some time. In the last few years our T4 wasn't allowed in downtown Paris for example, but we went camping, not on city trips. When at times we did want to visit a big city, we camped and took public transport downtown. The boat from the camping to Dubrovnik centre for example; great memories. Many camper owners do this already anyways, even if they dont drive diesels. Or they use bikes to get around.
 
Hi all. This is my first time posting but I have been following for a few months since placing an order for a new VW California, due in March 2021. In light of the plan to bring forward the ban on new diesel and petrol vehicles in 2030, do people think this is not a good idea now? We had our hearts set on our new van, and have started buying things to fill it, but we are now worried it will have poor resale value etc. On the other hand, is it's our van and we keep it for years without selling it, the ban should have little impact. We would really value your thoughts! Sarah
Stick with it Sarah, enjoy it for 20 years (maybe more). Forget the depreciation. After all, what’s the depreciation on a two week hotel holiday? It’s 100% :)
 
It may be useful to remember that the shift to autonomous (self driving) vehicles will happen at a similar pace to the plan (perhaps the previous plan) to phase out ICE vehicles.

If that wasn't a big enough change, they expect far fewer people will own cars. You will hire them like you do a Borris Bike. This becomes practical because they will drive themselves to collect you from your door.

You'll also hire the particular type of vehicle you need (City car, large estate, why not campervans).

So there is plenty to consider if you want to play the guessing game and position yourself optimally.
 
Don’t expect electric cars to save the planet
Banning petrol and diesel vehicles would deliver only minor emissions savings at a vast cost to consumers

Bjorn Lomborg
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In a move to burnish Britain’s green credentials, Boris Johnson is to announce a ban on the sale of new petrol and diesel cars from 2030. He is following other political leaders, including Joe Biden, in promising lavish carrots to energise the market for electric cars as well as sticks to outlaw petrol cars. Unfortunately, electric cars will deliver only tiny emissions savings at a very high price.
Electric cars are certainly fun, but usually cost more across their lifetime than their petrol counterparts. That is why subsidies are needed. And consumers are put off by the vehicles’ short ranges and long recharging times. Despite the US offering up to $10,000 (£7,600) for each electric car, for example, fewer than 0.5 per cent of the nation’s cars are battery electric. And almost all the handouts go to the rich. Some 90 per cent of electric car owners also own a fossil-fuel car. Indeed, electric vehicles are mostly a “second car” used for shorter trips and virtue signalling.
If you subsidise electric cars enough, people will buy them. Almost 10 per cent of all Norway’s passenger cars are now electric thanks to generous policies that waive most costs. Over its lifetime, a £23,000 car might receive benefits worth more than £20,000. But this approach is unsustainable for most nations. Even Norway is starting to worry; exempt drivers cost the country more than a billion euros a year.
Innovation will eventually make electric cars economical even without subsidies, but concerns over range and slow recharging will remain. That is why scientific projections do not predict that electric cars will take over the world. A new study shows that by 2030, just 13 per cent of new cars will be battery electric. If Johnson bans new petrol cars by then, he will essentially be prohibiting 87 per cent of consumers from buying the cars they want. That hardly seems politically viable.
The International Energy Agency (IEA) estimates that by 2030, if all countries live up to their promises, the world will have 140 million electric cars on the road. But this would not make a significant impact on emissions for two reasons. Firstly, electric cars require large batteries, which are often produced in China using coal power. The manufacture of one electric car battery releases almost a quarter of the greenhouse gases emitted by a petrol car across its entire lifetime.
Second, electric cars are recharged using electricity that is in most countries powered by fossil fuels. Together, this means that a long-range electric car will emit more CO2 for its first 60,000km than its petrol equivalent. This is why owning a second electric car for short trips could result in higher overall emissions. Comparing electric and petrol, the IEA estimates the electric car will save six tons of CO2 over its lifetime, assuming global average electricity emissions. Even if the electric car has a short range and its battery is made in Europe using mostly renewable energy, its savings will, at most, amount to 10 tons.
To use America as an example, if Biden restores the full electric car tax credit, he will essentially pay £5,700 to reduce emissions by up to 10 tons. Yet, he can get US power producers to cut 10 tons for just £45. Indeed, if the whole world follows through and gets to 140 million electric cars by 2030, the IEA estimates it will reduce emissions by just 190 million tons of CO2 – a mere 0.4 per cent of global emissions.
We need a reality check. First, politicians should stop writing huge cheques just because they believe electric cars are a major climate solution. Second, there is a simpler answer. The hybrid car saves about the same amount of CO2 as an electric car over its lifetime. Third, climate change doesn’t care where CO2 comes from. Personal cars represent about 7 per cent of global emissions, and electric cars will only help a little.
Right now, electric car subsidies are something wealthy countries can afford to offer virtue-signalling elites. But if we want to fix the climate, we need to focus on the big emitters and drive innovation in fusion, fission, geothermal, wind and solar energy. Advances that make any of these cheaper than fossil fuels would mean it is not just rich Londoners changing their habits, but everyone, including China and India, switching large parts of their energy consumption towards zero emissions.
Bjorn Lomborg is president of the Copenhagen Consensus Center
 
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