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Oil Comsumption / Engine Problems with 2010/2011 Cali's

calicasas

calicasas

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Can the D version of the EGR be retrofitted? Just thinking of prevention (hopefully the problem has not occurred on my engine yet). I suppose I should get the oil checked and the EGR examined.
Yes, you can get it retrofitted, just what I am trying to get arranged at the moment, but dealers seem perplexed at this decision saying that they wouldn't do that until the engine fails....??!! Really? With the greatest respect (I say) neither the dealer or VW provide guidance as to the failure, and most importantly, they don't have to pay for a new engine once it goes wrong... Duh.... Whilst my decision may prove to be right or wrong, at least I am being pro active in attempting damage limitation - of which dealers care nothing about...
 
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AlanC

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I think you are wise to consider this. I get my van back with a new engine tomorrow after the EGR corrosion wore the bores. I would have preferred to pay £1k for a new EGR than £7k for the whole engine.

Alan
 
BerndRos

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I think you are wise to consider this. I get my van back with a new engine tomorrow after the EGR corrosion wore the bores. I would have preferred to pay £1k for a new EGR than £7k for the whole engine.

Alan
Scandalous, Alan that VW are not making a gesture of goodwill.

When you think about it, the roof corrosion issue attracts a lot of attention on here, due I guess as we are mostly all affected.

But, these engine issues, attract little interest and the members here don't really want us to air it...Residuals...!

You can still drive a Cali with the roof issues...but as you and I know....the engine issue is very different....
 
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AlanC

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Scandalous, Alan that VW are not making a gesture of goodwill.

When you think about it, the roof corrosion issue attracts a lot of attention on here, due I guess as we are mostly all affected.

But, these engine issues, attract little interest and the members here don't really want us to air it...Residuals...!

You can still drive a Cali with the roof issues...but as you and I know....the engine issue is very different....
Unfortunately the oil consumption issue only affect vans with a 180 bhp engine. Compared to the other engine versions, that is a small number. The same applies to the T5 in all other variants, so no weight of numbers unfortunately.

Add to which we can only deal with VWUK. May be different if VW Germany took overall responsibility for this faulty engine.

Alan
 
calicasas

calicasas

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Any news on how much inc a new complete EGR costs ?
I have tentatively been quoted £1,372 from Lookers, Guildford, although it's not entirely clear what this includes. I have spent nearly three weeks trying to establish the details (in writing).
The issue here is that to replace the EGR, you need to remove the air-con matrix and I think part of the power steering. In addition, I assume they change the oil filter, maybe oil? Question is do they include all oils filters etc..? They said verbally that it did. I asked for this in writing and was later told that it didn't include the oil filter or oil. Wanting to know if it included the air-con re-gas etc.. I am still waiting... I won't be going to Lookers... Very poor service indeed...
Price depends on who you talk to... Above all, don't expect to get a full detailed written quote.. I can only guess they are looking at ways of charging extras at the end...
 
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calicasas

calicasas

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I think you are wise to consider this. I get my van back with a new engine tomorrow after the EGR corrosion wore the bores. I would have preferred to pay £1k for a new EGR than £7k for the whole engine.

Alan
I would be interested to know if you have been given a quote, if so where from.
Thanks...
 
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AlanC

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I would be interested to know if you have been given a quote, if so where from.
Thanks...

Mine was a quote for a complete engine change according to the latest TPI that covers the oil consumption issue for 180 engines. The aircon was re-gassed and obviously the engine was filled with 7 litres of new oil.

However, my service tech added the EGR to my initial quote in error as he thought the base engine did not include it. The price quoted was £720.46 to which you will need to add labour at about £75p/hr and VAT of course. There will be a time specified for this job, probably in the order of 8-10 hours.

As the EGR on the 180 is at the bottom of the engine at the front, the only way to get to it is to remove the from panel, oil cooler, aircon evaporator and radiator. So the aircon will have to be recharged on reassemble.

The EGR has the oil filter on the top of it. I would not be happy having the old one moved to a new EGR. The oil would also be used so I would insist on a flush and refill.

£1372.00 sounds about right to me. Using a dealer will also give you a warranty, which may be worth having.

Alan
 
BerndRos

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Mine was a quote for a complete engine change according to the latest TPI that covers the oil consumption issue for 180 engines. The aircon was re-gassed and obviously the engine was filled with 7 litres of new oil.

However, my service tech added the EGR to my initial quote in error as he thought the base engine did not include it. The price quoted was £720.46 to which you will need to add labour at about £75p/hr and VAT of course. There will be a time specified for this job, probably in the order of 8-10 hours.

As the EGR on the 180 is at the bottom of the engine at the front, the only way to get to it is to remove the from panel, oil cooler, aircon evaporator and radiator. So the aircon will have to be recharged on reassemble.

The EGR has the oil filter on the top of it. I would not be happy having the old one moved to a new EGR. The oil would also be used so I would insist on a flush and refill.

£1372.00 sounds about right to me. Using a dealer will also give you a warranty, which may be worth having.

Alan
On my first engine I went with the Long Life service regime, on my second engine I have had the service indicator set so I am NOT on Long Life service, how about you ?
 
snowy55

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View attachment 18038
Corroded egr cooler. Not my image. I believe the credit is owed to Fred from the TX forum.

Can anyone tell me how the flakey off corrosion bits get into the engine to cause the premature bore wear.

Do the corrosion particles get into the oil and wear the bore?
or
Do the corrosion particles get sucked in with air?
 
WelshGas

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Can anyone tell me how the flakey off corrosion bits get into the engine to cause the premature bore wear.

Do the corrosion particles get into the oil and wear the bore?
or
Do the corrosion particles get sucked in with air?
The theory is that the interior of the EGR valve/cooler breaks down and the particles are carried by the exhaust gas passing through the valve into the Engine Inlet along with fresh air and hence the cylinders.
IMG_0217.PNG
 
calicasas

calicasas

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T5 SE 180
Mine was a quote for a complete engine change according to the latest TPI that covers the oil consumption issue for 180 engines. The aircon was re-gassed and obviously the engine was filled with 7 litres of new oil.

However, my service tech added the EGR to my initial quote in error as he thought the base engine did not include it. The price quoted was £720.46 to which you will need to add labour at about £75p/hr and VAT of course. There will be a time specified for this job, probably in the order of 8-10 hours.

As the EGR on the 180 is at the bottom of the engine at the front, the only way to get to it is to remove the from panel, oil cooler, aircon evaporator and radiator. So the aircon will have to be recharged on reassemble.

The EGR has the oil filter on the top of it. I would not be happy having the old one moved to a new EGR. The oil would also be used so I would insist on a flush and refill.

£1372.00 sounds about right to me. Using a dealer will also give you a warranty, which may be worth having.

Alan
I was told to drop it off in the morning and pick it up at 5pm. Quoted exactly the same by SMG, but had nothing in writing from Lookers. Like many other times, I take my van into a VW dealership, get quoted one price and get slapped with extra cost. I don't want a £1,372 bill to turn into much more just because they add extras they hadn't stated. To-date, the cost above includes only EGR replacement, no oil, no filter etc... They quoted over £1,500 initially but then reduced the price.. Call me old fashioned, but this seems expensive...

I can get a 1-year warranty from my. Local garage, beyond that I may have VW 'goodwill' and judging by this and the Facebook forum, means nothing...
 
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AlanC

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On my first engine I went with the Long Life service regime, on my second engine I have had the service indicator set so I am NOT on Long Life service, how about you ?

Thanks for the reminder, I planned to change the oil every 10K anyway, but didn't get the computer set up for the reminder. I will go back and ask.

Alan
 
calicasas

calicasas

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Thanks for the reminder, I planned to change the oil every 10K anyway, but didn't get the computer set up for the reminder. I will go back and ask.

Alan
Interesting because I have been reliably informed that VW are instructing/recommending change for 2010/2011 engined vehicles from Long Life Service to Time & Distance service regime... This has been recommended for the CFCA engines... So I was told at a VW dealer..
 
calicasas

calicasas

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Can anyone tell me how the flakey off corrosion bits get into the engine to cause the premature bore wear.

Do the corrosion particles get into the oil and wear the bore?
or
Do the corrosion particles get sucked in with air?
Shame you can't send a scope down the EGR and check for corrosion without having to dismantle... Wait... Anyone Know if that can be done?
 
WelshGas

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Interesting because I have been reliably informed that VW are instructing/recommending change for 2010/2011 engined vehicles from Long Life Service to Time & Distance service regime... This has been recommended for the CFCA engines... So I was told at a VW dealer..
I'm not an engineer, but if the problem is due to breakdown in the EGR and particles getting into the Inlet manifold and hence the cylinder then why will changing the oil and filter more frequently be of any benefit?
I would love to know if the problem occurred more frequently on high annual mileage vehicles or low annual mileage vehicles?
 
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AlanC

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Interesting because I have been reliably informed that VW are instructing/recommending change for 2010/2011 engined vehicles from Long Life Service to Time & Distance service regime... This has been recommended for the CFCA engines... So I was told at a VW dealer..

Went back to the dealer yesterday and they reset the computer to 10k reminder for service.

BTW, apparently you don't need to advise DVLA of the engine change if you get an engine direct from Germany. The serial number of the new engine will be the same as the old one apparently.

Alan
 
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AlanC

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I'm not an engineer, but if the problem is due to breakdown in the EGR and particles getting into the Inlet manifold and hence the cylinder then why will changing the oil and filter more frequently be of any benefit?
I would love to know if the problem occurred more frequently on high annual mileage vehicles or low annual mileage vehicles?

I have never been happy with the long service period. When we bought a new Golf I insisted on it being set to 10k miles as it was being used to commute to work. Regular servicing seems to me to be the best way to maintain anything mechanical.

Alan
 
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AlanC

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I have never been happy with the long service period. When we bought a new Golf I insisted on it being set to 10k miles as it was being used to commute to work. Regular servicing seems to me to be the best way to maintain anything mechanical.

Alan
Having said that, this problem is very specific and I doubt that anything we did would change anything. Very bad design is the main issue. Recycling the exhaust is maybe the stupidest thing you can do to an engine.

Alan
 
BerndRos

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Having said that, this problem is very specific and I doubt that anything we did would change anything. Very bad design is the main issue. Recycling the exhaust is maybe the stupidest thing you can do to an engine.

Alan
Agreed....for those of us that have gone through this engine misery...it's just that, a misery.

Based on the recent posts re the Norway 'evidence' , sadly, I think very many more will be affected.

It seems to me that if your not yet using excessive oil, and have version 'C' or earlier of an EGR fitted, your well advised to spend £££ to have version 'D' fitted as the lesser of two evils.....
 
WelshGas

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I have never been happy with the long service period. When we bought a new Golf I insisted on it being set to 10k miles as it was being used to commute to work. Regular servicing seems to me to be the best way to maintain anything mechanical.

Alan
For low annual mileage couldn't agree more. Low mileage and short trips not good.
Fortunately I don't have that problem.
 
snowy55

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For low annual mileage couldn't agree more. Low mileage and short trips not good.
Fortunately I don't have that problem.

You can reset the service interval your self.
It's described in the owners manual.
No need to go to the dealers.
 
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AlanC

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You can reset the service interval your self.
It's described in the owners manual.
No need to go to the dealers.

That is interesting,

The 'Service Now' message came on a while back, after the usual count down, but was 10k miles early. Heritage in Bristol and Westbury both said I would need to take the van back to the servicing dealer (Breeze) to get it reset. As that is 2.5 hours away I decided to put up with the aural and visual abuse I was getting.

On Friday following the new engine installation, I went back to Heritage Bristol and asked them to reset the service period and the service message if possible. They did both without complaint.

Sometimes I despair......

Alan
 
WelshGas

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That is interesting,

The 'Service Now' message came on a while back, after the usual count down, but was 10k miles early. Heritage in Bristol and Westbury both said I would need to take the van back to the servicing dealer (Breeze) to get it reset. As that is 2.5 hours away I decided to put up with the aural and visual abuse I was getting.

On Friday following the new engine installation, I went back to Heritage Bristol and asked them to reset the service period and the service message if possible. They did both without complaint.

Sometimes I despair......

Alan
There is a difference between setting the Service Interval, and resetting a Service Alarm , which may be a "Latching" Alarm meaning it has to be reset using a Diagnostic Computer System.
 
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