The demise of diesel!

[vango]

I am lucky enough to own both an EV (BMW i3) and a diesel Cali. Different vehicles for completely different tasks.
I use the i3 daily - it costs virtually nothing (2p / mile) to run when charged off peak at night, and of course no emissions from my daily use. It’s a brilliant car for my needs. It has also made me a better driver and more mechanically sympathetic (looking ahead etc). The cost of battery production and disposal can of course be debated (I’ll leave that to others) but my philosophy is that this is my daily driver and I will use those batteries long long term. There is not much to wear out and I hope to be driving that car for many years.
The Cali on the other hand is for making family memories and having fun. We only really do long runs in it (not suited to EVs currently but great in a diesel), and only a few thousand miles a year. I also drive with a relatively light right foot.
I think it’s the individual’s overall carbon footprint that should be taken into account. Who knows, maybe Cali owners fly less (if at all) for holidays etc.

I think for now this is a good strategy and I'm looking to do the same. I just ordered a new Cali and intend to get an EV for daily driving. If the technology was available today for an EV camper van with a long enough range I'd buy that instead. But it isn't and life's too short to wait - I don't want to miss out on years of great experiences with my young 'un in the meantime.
The point about flying is also a good one - one long haul flight will generate more emissions than a year's worth of driving in a Cali for most people.

 

[two-saabs]

I think for now this is a good strategy and I'm looking to do the same. I just ordered a new Cali and intend to get an EV for daily driving. If the technology was available today for an EV camper van with a long enough range I'd buy that instead. But it isn't and life's too short to wait - I don't want to miss out on years of great experiences with my young 'un in the meantime.
The point about flying is also a good one - one long haul flight will generate more emissions than a year's worth of driving in a Cali for most people.

Absolutely agree on the life's too short, we couldn't afford a Cali when the kids were little, but would have totally gone for it.

Not sure on your maths for the last point, 1x single 20,000 mile trip done in a plane with 300 people onboard vs any diesel car with the same mileage with 1-4 passengers. The emissions and overall "bad for the planetness" I'd think is close.

But I stand to be corrected if anyone can add some numbers.

Ideally also need to include the overall impact of say 200 California's being built compared to 1 plane, but that gets a bit skewy for how to fairly count and compare.

 

[Velma's Dad]

Not sure on your maths for the last point, 1x single 20,000 mile trip done in a plane with 300 people onboard vs any diesel car with the same mileage with 1-4 passengers. The emissions and overall "bad for the planetness" I'd think is close.

But I stand to be corrected if anyone can add some numbers.

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a trip to Disney World:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return flight (4 pax, economy class) London-Orlando = CO2 emissions 8.9 tonnes.

 

[two-saabs]

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a trip to Disney World:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return flight (4 pax, economy class) London-Orlando = CO2 emissions 8.9 tonnes.

Now we're talking

So... Guilt free Cali drives all round! (Phew)

 

[vango]

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a trip to Disney World:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return flight (4 pax, economy class) London-Orlando = CO2 emissions 8.9 tonnes.

Thanks for the fact check!

 

[Amarillo]

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a trip to Disney World:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return flight (4 pax, economy class) London-Orlando = CO2 emissions 8.9 tonnes.

If you are going to Orlando you will probably be racking up the CO2 staying in an air conditioned hotel. Sleeping in the Cali you have those carbon neutral air vents in the pop top.

Orlando you have the carbon heavy theme parks. At Skegness you can swim in the sea and get your kids to bury you in the sand.

 

[Tilbo]

Wow,
What have i done...I only thought i'd get a couple of replies.
I'm going to start reading each & everyone of the replies, but one thing i am going to do (so many positive remarks) is buy the California and enjoy the time i can have with it now, and just see what the future brings and deal with what ever happens then.
Thanks very much for all the feedback, really appreciate it......

 

[WelshGas]

Well once we are allowed I’m off to Sydney, NSW to see my son and daughter-in-law.
What I won’t be doing is changing the California or Smart, both almost 7 yrs old, every 3 yrs, as some do.

 

[Wildcamper]

Is all this technology good for us? Time will tell. This will include materials for EVs.

Toxic metals are seeping into our BONES, study warns

This is the warning of experts from the Hebrew University of Jerusalem who studied lead pollution in the remains of 130 people buried in a cemetery in central Rome.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Pollewop]

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a trip to Disney World:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return flight (4 pax, economy class) London-Orlando = CO2 emissions 8.9 tonnes.

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a cycling holiday to the Lake District:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return trip (4 pax, normal bikes) Preston-Keswick = CO2 emissions 0.0 tonnes. ;-)

 

[Elmo3]

Diesel will be around for a long time, it will just be very, very expensive. Of course, once EV’s reach mass adoption, they too will be heavily taxed. No way will the govt tolerate a fall in tax revenues from motorists. Either way, we‘re going to have to pay. Look at red diesel being banned in the construction industry etc next year. More inflation heading our way.

 

[Wildcamper]

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a cycling holiday to the Lake District:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return trip (4 pax, normal bikes) Preston-Keswick = CO2 emissions 0.0 tonnes. ;-)

Not quite zero CO2 on the bike, each breath exhales CO2. Less than a Cali however.

 

[two-saabs]

Not quite zero CO2 on the bike, each breath exhales CO2. Less than a Cali however.

Lol, indeed... I think its safe to assume there is a minimum amount of C02 before we start counting

 

[WelshGas]

To be fair we should maybe consider a family of four - a year's worth of Cali'ing versus a cycling holiday to the Lake District:

Diesel Cali at (approx) 200g/km if average annual mileage of say 15,000km = CO2 emissions 3.0 tonnes.

Return trip (4 pax, normal bikes) Preston-Keswick = CO2 emissions 0.0 tonnes. ;-)

Do compare like with like.
You forgot the approximate 3,200 Litres of Urine to be processed and about 400 Kgms of s**t also the methane produced by the increased dietary requirements of your family of 4 covering a similar distance as the California.

 

[Bellcrew]

Do compare like with like.
You forgot the approximate 3,200 Litres of Urine to be processed and about 400 Kgms of s**t also the methane produced by the increased dietary requirements of your family of 4 covering a similar distance as the California.

Also all the food and drink consumed, the CO2 generated from the production of these comestibles etc, there is no end to this more pure than thou stuff.

 

[Velma's Dad]

Okay. And while we're at it then. This forum thread debating the relative CO2 impacts of Cali'ing will have involved consumption of 1.76g of CO2 per page view (source: online carbon calculator Website Carbon, based on an average web page). So if say 100 members have viewed all five pages (or okay probably more like 5 members, twenty times each but whatevs) this debate has contributed getting towards a kg of CO2, so far.

That's a lot of hot air.

 

[two-saabs]

Okay. And while we're at it then. This forum thread debating the relative CO2 impacts of Cali'ing will have involved consumption of 1.76g of CO2 per page view (source: online carbon calculator Website Carbon, based on an average web page). So if say 100 members have viewed all five pages (or okay probably more like 5 members, twenty times each but whatevs) this debate has contributed getting towards a kg of CO2, so far.

That's a lot of hot air.

Now you're part of the problem, and I bet you had the lights on AND the fridge running whilst typing too! #planetDestroyer

 

[Velma's Dad]

Now you're part of the problem, and I bet you had the lights on AND the fridge running whilst typing too! #planetDestroyer

AND dual-screening, streaming repeats of the Catherine Tate Show.

 

[mountainman]

Just do it.

If you don't, you'll regret it.

As for the demise of diesel, by the time that happens you could have made many happy memories. Also EVs are only a stop gap measure. They aren't the answer either. So any future EV Cali is bound to be short lived as well.

I am sure that is exactly right!!

 

[keith morris]

Hi
With the governments new rules on the ban of new car sales of both petrol & diesel to start in 2030, what are peoples thoughts on buying a new California now, or in the next couple of years? Would you worry about further rules coming into force, bans for driving to certain places, resale values, higher fuel & taxes etc.
Would you delay purchase and wait for, hopefully a new electric version!
Interested to hear some thoughts on this topic.
Thanks for any replies.

Life is too short to worry about what is going to happen in 9 years, enjoy while you can, look at the last two years as an example where our freedom was severely restricted. There is so many things wrong with Boris 10 point strategy that a schoolchild could poke holes on it, our nuclear capability is shrinking and will be offline before the new ones come online and all that will coincide with the Ban on diesels. Hydrogen could be the answer JCB are building diggers and buses on this platform already and will be trials in cities as we speak,
Peugeot and Renault already have tests on vans using fuel cells so I wouldn’t be too worried about the alternatives in the medium to long term. The real elephant in the room is the politicians ineptitude at dealing with the issues, we all hate plastic and are happy to chop down the Brazilian rainforest to make biomass for our green boilers for example. Plastics aren’t bad it’s people who are irresponsible. My view is you have some seriously clever and competent people in the likes of JCB and other tech companies within the U.K. who will no doubt come up with a solution that works for us all. Personally I enjoy my Cali and I’m not too fussed if it’s diesel for the time being or hydrogen or an alternative fuel source in the future. At the end of the day we still need to enjoy ourselves and have a decent quality of life

 

[Cliffuk]

Hi
With the governments new rules on the ban of new car sales of both petrol & diesel to start in 2030, what are peoples thoughts on buying a new California now, or in the next couple of years? Would you worry about further rules coming into force, bans for driving to certain places, resale values, higher fuel & taxes etc.
Would you delay purchase and wait for, hopefully a new electric version!
Interested to hear some thoughts on this topic.
Thanks for any replies.

I would be interested to know all your thoughts about this issue. I ordered a new California in for delivery next march

 

[PeteS]

Well I think that using a diesel Cali to go on holiday is better for the environment than taking a flight somewhere. Maybe we should be lobbing for a reduction in tax on campervans.
If everyone was to convert to electric heating, cooking and driving are we sure we have enough electricity to power all these items.

 

[Blueeyedboy]

From my understanding this so called ban on diesels doesn’t effect the California’s as they are classed as commercial vehicle.
You may not be able to order a new one and possibly other alternatives will be available. Plug in’s are banned 2035 for cars.
As mentioned I wouldn’t worry about it at all enjoy what the California has to offer you especially after the last 18months.
One life live it.

 

[Denzilgts]

I would live your life and buy the California with a few previsos

we only use the van for longer trips on a weekend or holidays

I use a bike for my shopping and local trips regardless of weather

I have done this throughout lockdown and will continue. For example we all remember news items in lockdown showing wildlife returning , coastlines cleaner, clearer seas around Venice etc. With just a few weeks of global reduction in travel . If we all reduce and use other forms of travel where needed we should use our current transport longer.

only my opinion

 

[hirsty]

Take a look at a real world test, Guy drove to John a groats, EV cost far out weigh fossil fuel and was a real test of current charging tech, which didn’t perform well. In summary double the cost and time !

that was a journey planned to give the best result for EV, which sadly went wrong in the real world scenario

or watch the Youtube vid of a Tesla owner from York planning & doing his usual weeks family holiday in the south west with little to no fuss at all.

these endless weekly 'but how will it all work ?!' whinges are tedious - technology is accelerating so quickly now & we're already approaching the tipping point for mass adoption & economies of scale.

to answer the OPs question I'm not at all worried about getting another few years (5 ?, 10 ?) out of my current diesel Cali, but I don't expect to buy another new IC car 'in the future'.